Tow vehicle shopping woes

[Bigblockyeti]

I'm casually shopping around for a larger truck, a 1/2 ton will do all I want and then some, a 3/4 ton would be far beyond what I would want or need or be willing to spend on a depreciating asset. I've looked at GM and they stopped caring about building a 1/2 ton truck for doing truck stuff when they offered a decently powerful 6.2L engine, but only in high spec trim levels and burning premium fuel, both are non-starters for me. Dodge seems to me like they're always on the verge of producing a reliable transmission, just can't evolve past the verge into reality. Ford seems like they still offer a 1/2 ton truck for actually being used as a truck and not something crossed shopped with a $110K Sucker Urbanite Vehicle. I was able to spec out a 2023 2wd F-150 with the 3.5LTT engine, crewcab, 6.5' bed and spartan interior with rubber floors & black urethane steering wheel for $46,930 which certainly would have to be ordered. Probably wouldn't have to pay above MSRP but highly unlikely it would be under and I'd have to wait a while for it to be built too. Here's the rub, it actually doesn't have any towing package despite being able to tow 11,300lbs as equipped, the "max towing package" is really just an invitation to spend another $4K. The only functionalily in that package is an integrated brake controller, class IV towing hitch, larger rear springs and 3.73 (vs. the 3.55 locking I spec'd) locking rear axle & 9.75" ring gear (presumably an overall larger axle assembly). It also includes a littany of dodads that might make trailering easier for someone who has no business pulling a trailer in the first place, it doesn't even include trailer towing mirrors. The class IV hitch and brake controller I can source for under $350 in the aftermarket, the same for towing mirrors at ~$150 vs. whatever ford charges for them. The bigger axle, 3.73 ratio and heavier springs having a net price of over $3650 seems like a bad case of diminishing returns or greedy execs. or marketing incompetence, I'm guessing a blend. I know I'm ranting but I remember when you could pick what you wanted a la carte from any of the big three, including a proper manual transmission.

This is making a 2023 E350 cut away chassis with the Godzilla motor for $38K and change start to seem like a bargain!

 

[Knobs]

I'm casually shopping around for a larger truck, a 1/2 ton will do all I want and then some, a 3/4 ton would be far beyond what I would want or need or be willing to spend on a depreciating asset. I've looked at GM and they stopped caring about building a 1/2 ton truck for doing truck stuff when they offered a decently powerful 6.2L engine, but only in high spec trim levels and burning premium fuel, both are non-starters for me. Dodge seems to me like they're always on the verge of producing a reliable transmission, just can't evolve past the verge into reality. Ford seems like they still offer a 1/2 ton truck for actually being used as a truck and not something crossed shopped with a $110K Sucker Urbanite Vehicle. I was able to spec out a 2023 2wd F-150 with the 3.5LTT engine, crewcab, 6.5' bed and spartan interior with rubber floors & black urethane steering wheel for $46,930 which certainly would have to be ordered. Probably wouldn't have to pay above MSRP but highly unlikely it would be under and I'd have to wait a while for it to be built too. Here's the rub, it actually doesn't have any towing package despite being able to tow 11,300lbs as equipped, the "max towing package" is really just an invitation to spend another $4K. The only functionalily in that package is an integrated brake controller, class IV towing hitch, larger rear springs and 3.73 (vs. the 3.55 locking I spec'd) locking rear axle & 9.75" ring gear (presumably an overall larger axle assembly). It also includes a littany of dodads that might make trailering easier for someone who has no business pulling a trailer in the first place, it doesn't even include trailer towing mirrors. The class IV hitch and brake controller I can source for under $350 in the aftermarket, the same for towing mirrors at ~$150 vs. whatever ford charges for them. The bigger axle, 3.73 ratio and heavier springs having a net price of over $3650 seems like a bad case of diminishing returns or greedy execs. or marketing incompetence, I'm guessing a blend. I know I'm ranting but I remember when you could pick what you wanted a la carte from any of the big three, including a proper manual transmission.

This is making a 2023 E350 cut away chassis with the Godzilla motor for $38K and change start to seem like a bargain!

My 2021 Silverado 1500 with the 6.2l engine drinks regular very happily.

From the Owner's Manual:

Recommended Fuel (6.2L V8 Engine)

Premium unleaded gasoline meeting ASTM specification D4814 with a posted octane
rating of 93 — (R+M)/2 — is highly recommended for best performance and fuel
economy. Unleaded gasoline with an octane rated as low as 87 can be used.

According to all of the online research I have done, the "best performance and fuel economy" is marginal, if it is real at all. If you don't get pinging, you're fine.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

Seems you have made up your mind, I think? Like knobs post above, my 5.7 is happy with 87 octane. Over 100k and counting without anything issues. Heavy metal is better for towing. Yes even if the trailer is a utility trailer. 6 cylinder engines, no matter how equipped are generally more suited as daily drivers.

I grew up a standard trans guy, but when you need to throw the clutch further than normal to start the engine, back problems start. That combined with steeper shift points, make a quality 8+speed automatic transmission a no brainer. Oh I guess I didn't state my ZF transmission has roughly 500 rpm shift points. It is a low friction transmission and has a very good reputation, also with 100k miles with no signs of weakness, with mostly towing miles.

Like I said, it sounds like you have you heart set, and I won't interfere with what your heart is telling you.

My .002 worth.

 

[sanda]

I'm on my 4th ram since 2004 and never a Trans issue. Towed many miles with no problems.

 

[Rosy]

I'm happy with my Tundra. New gen has more power and higher payload and towing but I know it's a controversial vehicle and not just in the looks department.

 

[Bigblockyeti]

I'm happy with my Tundra. New gen has more power and higher payload and towing but I know it's a controversial vehicle and not just in the looks department.

Last fall I was reading a comparision between similarly equipped '22 Tundra and '21 F-150 and the F-150 beat the Toyota in every category by 3-10% from towing, mileage, fuel economy, handling, braking, towing, acceleration & fuel capacity all for about $4K less ($2K less for the same '22 MY). I missed out on ordering exactly what I wanted in a 2020 Tundra for $38K with six passenger seating, max towing and an 8' bed with 4x4, that was also with the 400K mile 5.7L V-8 vs. the new tiny turbo motor. That same setup is no longer available and the next closest thing is $63K. I know [mod edit politics] to lower our expectations but the low part of "lower" seems to have no bottom!

 

[tdkkart]

Agree with most everything you say, but wouldn't have any of the Ecoburst engines, certainly not for towing anything.

 

[Bigblockyeti]

I don't really want one, but the torque they produce at a relatively low speed can't be touched by anything shy of a big block. I will say that for $38K and change that cutaway E350 with a normal 6 speed auto vs. the zillion speed (and failure point) slush boxes, dually or not and 7.3L motor is starting to look appealing for a custom build especially with a 11,500GVWR and 18,500GCWR. Heck, that's still $10K less than my brother just spent on a mid-level trim Honda Odyssey

 

[mjeds]

I've been shopping as well, and I settled on the GM Sierra 1500 3.0L Duramax Turbo-Diesel Engine

lots of them around, I believe it is the elevation model.

sample

2022 GMC Sierra 1500 Elevation for sale in Palmdale, CA - CARFAX

Make a more informed buying decision at CARFAX by first viewing vehicle history on this 2022 GMC Sierra 1500 Elevation.

www.carfax.com

 

[Bigblockyeti]

The problem I see is carmax is calling a used 1/2 ton truck priced at $53K+ a "great deal" which is anything but to me. The best I've seen so far was a clean 2014 RAM 2500 4×4 diesel with 6 seatbelts and 70K miles for $40K. The seller was going to sell it with the camper and allegedly for a "good deal" but the camper needed a little work before he was ready to sell it and the truck sold pretty quickly alone. I priced out a new F150 with a bunch more power than that diesel 1/2 ton GMC for under $47K new.

 

[mjeds]

used vehicle rates have been sky high since 2021 due to a shortage of vehicles (or so they claim), hell I had a 2017 Camry XLE Hybrid with 34,000 miles on it that I paid $28,000 for brand new in 2017 and I sold it 10-2022 for $23,000 to carmax, they resold it for $26,000, in 2019 the best offer I got for it with 20,000 miles on it was $15,400.

interest rates are sky high as well, looking at 8% or higher on a used vehicle right now, just like home loan rates are 6% or higher.

Now is not the time to buy anything. Credit cards are 25% plus as well for most people. The Fed keeps raising rates and the middle class is falling further and further into debt.

My divorce cost me my home, court forced me to sell and divide, so now I'm living in my Travel Trailer, because I will not even think about purchasing another home with rates this high.

Rents are ridiculous now as well. My mortgage in L.A. for a 2000 sq ft 3bd 2 bath home was $2,400 at 1.75% I can't even find a 1 bd 1 bath apartment in this area for that.

and I make a good 6 figure income. I could easily buy another home, but no way at these rates.

for me, it is time to just hunker down and wait it out.

 

[Bigblockyeti]

You're not alone in the hunker down and wait it out camp. I couldn't imagine having to finance a vehicle right now. Whomever shows up to fix this colossal mess in '24 has really got their work cut out for them.

 

[widdershins]

In the meantime, keep your eyes open... check dealer inventory. Years ago I wandered on to a Ram 1500 that came from the factory with everything I wanted and nothing I didn't. It was part of a commercial deal for x vehicles that turned into x-1, because it was the base trim the dealer made me a really nice offer (below MSRP)...

Patience may pay off, or I just got damned lucky ;-).

 

[Bigblockyeti]

Sounds like you just got darn lucky but timing and "years ago" probably helped quite a bit. What I'm looking for is far more truck and far less Gulfstream G5 option list, those lines seem to have been blurred more than a little over the past ~1.5 decade. From a shareholders standpoint these $5 options that are sold for $1500 are awesome but when some little thing that's needed to make a truck perform better as a truck mandates another $23 worth of stuff sold at $5600, the manufacturers have clearly lost site. I see more tax payer funded bailouts due to shortsightedness coming in 3 - 2 - 1

 

[Kevin D Pem]

Sounds like you just got darn lucky but timing and "years ago" probably helped quite a bit. What I'm looking for is far more truck and far less Gulfstream G5 option list, those lines seem to have been blurred more than a little over the past ~1.5 decade. From a shareholders standpoint these $5 options that are sold for $1500 are awesome but when some little thing that's needed to make a truck perform better as a truck mandates another $23 worth of stuff sold at $5600, the manufacturers have clearly lost site. I see more tax payer funded bailouts due to shortsightedness coming in 3 - 2 - 1

You and more than half the world, we just try keeping it to ourselves here.

 

[widdershins]

What.. you no want 40" TV screen in your truck????? Too bad.. we don't sell the base model anymore, only models with mandatory packages...

sounds like the RV industry..

 

[Buc]

What.. you no want 40" TV screen in your truck????? Too bad.. we don't sell the base model anymore, only models with mandatory packages...

sounds like the RV industry..

Yep. That’s why our Suburban has a sunroof. A sunroof that will have a Yakima Skybox over it as soon as I can get it installed (I’m picking up the roof crossbars tomorrow).

 

[Bigblockyeti]

I can get what I want, like the chassis cab I mentioned earlier, I just have to finish it myself.

 

[Breeze44]

We have a 2004 F150 XLT 5.4 6.5' bed extended cab, which pulled our camper okay, but we had almost no payload capacity left over. So, we looked fora new truck, found a 2022 F250 STX 7.3 crew cab. Truck came with snowplow/camper prep and Pro backup. The thing that sold me was the payload capacity which is 3187lb. Also has the upfitter switches with 397-amp alternator(s). 59k MSRP. I love the truck even though it's not an XLT. Has heated mirrors and a few other bells and whistles. I just couldn't see paying over 65k to 75k just to have all the fancy stuff. It basically is a upgraded work truck. I couldn't be happier.