Rear or side radiator

[jptrans1]

I am looking at a listing which shows a 2006 Newmar Kountry Star with the 350 ISL engine. The pictures show a rear radiator, but Newmar’s brochure shows it to have side radiators. What’s up? RV is 700 miles away and don’t want to was a trip. Cannot connect with the owner yet.

 

[Fish]

I look through for sale ads and I see both side and rear radiators.

 

[Neal]

For someone with minor hoarding tendencies and also does not do own maintenance, I enjoy the additional storage compartments on rear left aft side. I use it to store quite a bit of stuff from water softener, di rinse for pressure washing, power cables, spare fluids, etc. etc.

 

[Neemer]

I had two criteria when I upgraded: Genset on slide and side radiator. I’m getting too old to put my body through the unnatural contortions it takes to work on a motorhome with a rear radiator.

 

[redbaron]

2006 mountain master chassis by spartan was all side radiator in 2006. A handful where made with freightliner rear radiator due to supply issues in 2006.

 

[jptrans1]

2006 mountain master chassis by spartan was all side radiator in 2006. A handful where made with freightliner rear radiator due to supply issues in 2006.

The unit I am looking at is on a Spartan chassis but does have a rear radiator. Perhaps I can call Newmars customer service and get an answer.

 

[redbaron]

The unit I am looking at is on a Spartan chassis but does have a rear radiator. Perhaps I can call Newmars customer service and get an answer.

Do you have the coach serial number?

 

[DavidL]

If the engine needs service, you would pray for a side radiator model. Rear radiator is much more difficult to access the engine. Even if you aren't doing the service yourself its a consideration because the labor price will be much higher.

 

[Neal]

If the engine needs service, you would pray for a side radiator model. Rear radiator is much more difficult to access the engine. Even if you aren't doing the service yourself its a consideration because the labor price will be much higher.

I'm not sure facts back this up, just my opinion. I've had an oil pan gasket replaced, no big deal. I've had a head gasket replaced, also no big deal. The rear radiator is removed and full access is right there.

 

[DavidL]

Hi Neal, you are saying the radiator was removed to gain access? Not required for side mounts.

 

[Neal]

Hi Neal, you are saying the radiator was removed to gain access? Not required for side mounts.

That's what Cummins did for the head gasket replace. Yes, I know not required, point is engine access is still not an issue. If service was going to be an issue they probably would never rear mount a radiator. This was a major service, under warranty thankfully. But all other services at Gaffney have never been an issue either. To me, rear vs. side based on maintenance concerns is not a concern for me from my experience with the rear radiator coach.

I don't do my own maintenance, if I did, yeah, I'd probably prefer side radiator for that aspect. The rear radiator has worked well and I've enjoyed the two additional basement storage compartments.

 

[DavidL]

I will predict Removing / Replacing a rear radiator would be about 6 hours incremental. It's big and heavy and somewhat delicate. Plus the cost of the coolant replacement as it is unlikely anyone would reuse it. So call it 6 * $150 or $600 in labor and maybe $200 in coolant.
Even though your repair was covered under warranty...you paid for that service when you first purchased the RV baked into it's selling price. These types of service procedures drives up "EPUR" (Expense per Unit Repaired) which drives up the marketing cost of providing the warranty (I am the father of the "5/50" warranty at Chrysler) .
As a guy that does do all my service (as you know), it is a PITA to have a radiator in your way to do routine maintenance like replacing drive belts. One has to be agile to try to work over / under the radiator. The more senior a DIY'r gets, the more challenging. And you have to wait hours for the Engine to get cold before you can try working around a radiator. Oil changes typically aren't an issue because the fill tube is usually over the top of the radiator.
Each RV chassis will be a bit different, so the above is a generalization.

So that's the cost of those two extra baggage compartments.
I could swear my 36' bounder had more storage room than the 43' MountainAire...

 

[Neal]

All I'm saying and got side tracked is I haven't seen a shop or heard of one that has different labor rates for different radiator configurations.

Major repair is ugly any way you look at it. Routine service I don't think is any different between the two. It's expensive on all.

 

[DavidL]

The labor Rate doesn't change, the number of hours does. ie: more expensive.
Even if the radiator doesn't have to be removed, the additional time it takes to maneuver around it increases flat rate hours to do a given service. You won't see this in a line item on a service invoice. It's baked into the prime service operation.

When a time study is done, the actual time for a very seasoned technician with training and all the proper tools is timed to do an operation. Reality is typically longer because it's unlikely the tech at the dealership has all his / her ducks in a row to beat factory time. This of course assumes the manufacturer actually does time studies which is very expensive to do. Otherwise, they bill on actual time, or guestimated.
At least in automotive, the factory time studies have a multiple of hours applied to it and is published by the popular cross brand time studies used for customer pay work. This is because of the expense to do those time studies and no ready access to the vehicles to do the time studies. Of course these publishing companies never admit this... So, after warranty, you pay not just the real difference of time, but also times a mulitplier.

 

[MapNerd]

As another owner of a rear radiator, I agree with @Neal, I don’t think it makes much of a difference. I just had chassis service performed at NIRVC, and it was a flat rate for the 24-month service, not an hourly rate.

From my perspective, if you have a rear radiator and it’s being removed to gain that much access to the engine and it’s not being done for PM which in my experience is billed as a flat rate, something has probably gone terribly wrong and the added cost for removing and reinstalling the radiator is going to be a rounding error on the total bill.

If you plan to do your own PM though, yeah a side radiator is going to make life easier.

JMHO. YMMV.

 

[DavidL]

As another owner of a rear radiator, I agree with @Neal, I don’t think it makes much of a difference. I just had chassis service performed at NIRVC, and it was a flat rate for the 24-month service, not an hourly rate.

From my perspective, if you have a rear radiator and it’s being removed to gain that much access to the engine and it’s not being done for PM which in my experience is billed as a flat rate, something has probably gone terribly wrong and the added cost for removing and reinstalling the radiator is going to be a rounding error on the total bill.

If you plan to do your own PM though, yeah a side radiator is going to make life easier.

JMHO. YMMV.

Being that I avoid going to any repair shops for pretty much anything (even though the great majority of my career was spent supporting dealership service...) The "flat rate" for the service...isn't that based upon what Service and to which RV? ie: could the Side radiator person get a different rate for a drive belt replacement than a rear radiator RV? I do know for a fact that I would not want to service a rear radiator RV...PITA. Now, generally RV service is a heck of a lot easier than Auto service. MUCH more room to get to whatever. Just bigger parts and tighter bolts.

But if $'s isn't an issue and someone else is dealing with it, then the additional storage is nice. Most all that are buying large DPs aren't doing the wrenching themselves anyway. Just us glutens for punishment

 

[MapNerd]

The "flat rate" for the service...isn't that based upon what Service and to which RV?

Entirely plausible. I did not ask for quotes for a side-radiator equipped coach that I don’t have.

 

[DavidL]

rear radiator discussion:

I want to see my engine - iRV2 Forums

2019 37 Ventana LE with a rear radiator and a full sheet metal cover "shroud" blocking most everything when you open the exterior hinged access. And the sheet metal shroud is held in place

www.irv2.com

 

[Neal]

rear radiator discussion:

I want to see my engine - iRV2 Forums

2019 37 Ventana LE with a rear radiator and a full sheet metal cover "shroud" blocking most everything when you open the exterior hinged access. And the sheet metal shroud is held in place

www.irv2.com

Discuss here

 

[Neal]

Try posting a link from that thread to this thread.