Spartan chassis owners, be aware.

[GUS2000]

sounds like you and Liz Amazing will be interviewed soon...

 

[redbaron]

sounds like you and Liz Amazing will be interviewed soon...

Maybe you are not interested in this topic, since you have a freightliner.

You should know that your dash is correct because of a campaign I did in 2019 to have Freightliner recall their digital dash for being too bright. If the internet community had not stepped up, you would be dealing with that problem still.

 

[GUS2000]

I was basically stating a fact that since you and Liz were the catalysts, you both should be part of the investigative interviews with NHTSA. Better to be a part of the solution than part of the problem.. Let me paint a picture for you on this since i spent 15 years working in product safety and liability. Anyone who makes a public statement about a potential issue was always part of the investigation to try to define the true scope of the problem. There are clear steps to be taken in an issue that involves product safety and liability. Guessing you misunderstood my brief post... so hope this provides clarity as I was not trying to minimize your efforts.. .

 

[redbaron]

The stark contrast between myself and others promoting the issue revolves around standing.

I am an affected consumer. I don’t have a monetary outcome from raising awareness, but rather am looking to prevent a monetary loss.

The promoters on YouTube like Liz are being paid to make content and sell books etc. they are looking for the immediate profit for self.

I am looking for risk mitigation and trying to educate others that are in a similar situation, many of who are not aware they are at risk.

 

[Neal]

https://www.rvtravel.com/newmar-breaks-silence-seized-rv-vin-rules/

 

[redbaron]

If you missed the poll thread, its here:

Thread 'Spartan & Newmar Vin Poll'

Monday at 8:31 PM

By now most everyone knows about the issue with Spartan Chassis and the lack of a 17-digit VIN on the frame.

We have had endless discussions about the regulations found here:

https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-4...ter-V/part-565

Key Facts:
1) Spartan is the 1st Stage builder as defined above

2) Newmar is the final stage builder as defined above

3) Each builder is required to place a permanent VIN on their components

4) Spartan delivers to Newmar a raw chassis without a 17-digit VIN attached. They do engrave 5 digits of the vin on the frame, but this is not compliance.

5)...

• redbaron
• Replies: 0
• Forum: Newmar Owners Club

I have tried to get this on the facebook group, but the admin thinks I am just stirring the pot, so its not allowed.

 

[Neal]

It's probably time to let it rest and let's see how things transpire. Let's give Newmar and Spartan time now and see if we have a solution by the end of October.

 

[GUS2000]

Completely agree with the FB admins and with Neal on this one.. Does not do any good to keep pointing fingers on an issue where all the facts are unknown.. Lets get back to camping please!!

 

[redbaron]

Sounds like the Freightliner owners are sick and tired hearing about and reading of the problems the Spartan owners have. Same everywhere.

It’s not a big deal when it’s not your risk.

 

[Neal]

Screaming about it every day does not bring action. The issue has been raised loud and clear and heard by all key players. Big players don't find remedies overnight. They need to validate the issue (paper VIN's) and come up with a corrective action. Public companies on top of that are not going to move overnight. You know this. Now it's time to trust in the system, the companies involved and let them develop a corrective course of action. How long did it take for your FL dash issue to be rectified? I doubt it was overnight.

Have faith, trust in the system, trust in the volume (dB's) of the issue and let it work its way through the system to be resolved which I'm sure will be a good outcome as I have faith in those involved.

This thread will remain open for any developing updates that people want to share as we learn of them.

Edit: The Spartan TPMS issue (not sure if both vendors were affected) was another example. It takes time.

 

[redbaron]

Screaming? That’s a stretch.

You will notice that most of the heat is around offsetting the campaign Newmar did.

Why?

Because people tend to believe big corporations and need to be shown the truth.

Understanding the issue is complex. Heck it took me several days to understand.

Every day more people are running the story and its growing legs. That is natural way of making the change.

I won’t go to far off topic, but the dash issue took this exact same type of posting, and had multiple threads shutdown before it gained enough momentum to get the word out for people to call NHtSA. Then within weeks we got confirmation that NHTSA was actively working the issue. From there the campaign stopped and time passed while the recall was processed, which was a little over 10months from the last conversation I had with the lead investigator.

How does that relate to Spartan and Newmar vin?

Right now is a PR battle with Newmar actively dodging the bullet. Last week I asked dealers to help, and one dealer has stepped up.

So a post made on Thursday last week asking for help had immediate response.

We are still in the midst of capturing owners attention to have them speak up.

Calling Spartan, Newmar, and NHTSA are the correct paths. Don’t believe the PR statements that have no legal context and have been heavily redacted after the President was shown his personal liability.

These are all fast moving and current actions taking place. You don’t retreat when the other side pauses to consider a retreat. You press on.

The status as of today:

NIRVC has told at least one customer that their Essex will not be accepted without a proper VIN on the Spartan chassis.

Newmar has not admitted to any issue existing with their coaches on a Spartan Chassis.

Spartan has been silent.

We have had some good discussions on the issue, and my personal thoughts are that this was an oversight of Spartan years ago that just never got revisited.

The laws regarding vin identity are complex and without an automobile background and close working relationships with NHTSA, a small manufacturing shop may just not have known.

For Newmars part, i believe it first came up
With the king Aire issue. That topic is really very complex, and not one that I want to weigh in on directly, but it did bring us to the core issue of Vin placement.

Newmar is the largest dealer of Spartan chassis, and has been. There are others such as American Coach, Entegra, Foretravel, Travel supreme (defunct) and various smaller brands that sell consumer products. All the manufacturers have the same issue and if you own one of their products, they should be contacted as well.

Expected action:
1) Spartan to work with final builders (Aka: Newmar et al) to issue a remedy

2) NHTSA to issue a statement of understanding and compliance for the 5 digit stamp and wall placed sticker on final assembly


Either outcome is good, but until either Newmar or Spartan issue a public statement that they are working with NHTSA to reach an understanding, our job is not done.

 

[Joe Dutchstar]

Generally I am against public outcry on complex issues as most comments miss basic facts or in place remedies, some are just posting are just for Clicks. Corvairs come to mind.
In this case, while complex, I can see the issues reasonably clearly, and have an asset directly involved.
The Tubman Newmar Corporate response and privately the Spartan responses are expected from the Public Company perspective.
My question is more about supporting the consumer. If what happened to the Canadian couple happens to you, then what?? It doesn’t have to be crossing a Border.
Insurance or registration inspection, whatever, what is Newmar’s response?? And how long and how much more money does it take to resolve the issue??