MOD Water pump upgrade with accumulator tank

[Neal]

Thanks. I have a valterra check valve coming I'm going to put prior to the pump input line. I'll inspect tomorrow to see if I can figure out where the existing check valve is, if any. This should fix the issue to keep the water flow only going into the pump and not back from the accumulator pressure.

Amazon.com

 

[flyboy013]

@Neal - See this post and the ones following it. I had same issue this past summer. The check valve is behind the panel and up high. You can fill for it and change it without taking panel off. I also creating a flow diagram which may help.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

Thanks. I have a valterra check valve coming I'm going to put prior to the pump input line. I'll inspect tomorrow to see if I can figure out where the existing check valve is, if any. This should fix the issue to keep the water flow only going into the pump and not back from the accumulator pressure.

Amazon.com

Did your problem start after your freeze? If so a fragment from the filter may have caused your problem.

 

[Neal]

@Neal - See this post and the ones following it. I had same issue this past summer. The check valve is behind the panel and up high. You can fill for it and change it without taking panel off. I also creating a flow diagram which may help.

Thank you. I'll check for that today, either way inlining the valterra check valve in the visible portion of hose lower left of the wet bay panel prior to the pump should work as well. I see the next reply has the link to the replacement valve as well so I'll get one of those on the way. I'll try one of the two options, for now all works as long as the city water endpoint is capped off or connected to an open city water spigot.

 

[Joe Hogan]

The pump should have a check valve in it as once line pressure reaches the set value, the line pressure is maintained. Pressure is maintained until water is requested that reduces line pressure below set value.

 

[Joe Hogan]

Here is a review from Amazon. Note comments about mitigation of noise

These are pretty much the best performing pump you can get. They are also very high quality. The motor is heavy duty. They can also easily (and quickly) pump up to 120 PSI if you let them - they are that powerful. Fortunately, they come preset to 60 PSI max. Many complain about noise with this pump, that is not the pump itself, it's how you mount it and how the lines are routed to it. The recommended approach with these pumps is to put flexible hose to and from the pump. I did that but it made a horrible racket. It didn't matter how I repositioned it. So the other day I re-plumbed the suction and discharge side with 1/2" PEX. I changed the layout of the lines and now it's very quiet. If I put some insulation (rubber) under the pump it will probably be close to silent. Don't over tighten the mounting screws. Try it with them a bit loose to see how that affects the noise. This is one of the best pumps you can get, but you have to want to make it work. If that means fiddling with the mounting to make it quiet, so be it. Also, I've bought a few off Amazon and had to send them back because of shipping damage. For some reason, some models are just sent out the stock box put in a plastic bag. This one was shipped double-boxed (fortunately) and arrived safe and sound. I'm actually running this pump with a separate pressure switch (adjustable cut in and cut out) and also a variable speed controller for the pump. This way I have total control over the pump, with respect to volume and pressure. None of that is required, I just have a custom water system for high pressure and low flow to work with my on-demand water heater in my RV. You can just 'plug 'n play' this pump as it has conventional 1/2" RV fittings and it's own pressure switch. It also varies the pump speed using Pulse Width Modulation so it will increase speed or decrease speed as needed. It's really quite the pump. I highly recommend it if you need volume and pressure. You can run multiple faucets/showers/clothes washer all at the same time. Update: I relocated the pump later on, added a larger accumulator and needed longer lines. I chose not to hard plumb it with PEX this time and instead used stainless braided lines from Amazon. They were quite inexpensive and you get the benefit of rattle absorbing rubber lines encased in stainless braid. That worked out quite well and seems to be the quietest solution yet. Even so, I tie-strapped them so they weren't rubbing on anything. Not expensive to do and looks very cool. In the pic above you can see my custom solution. None of that is required, you can just use the pump as a stock replacement for yours right out of the box. I just wanted to do the pump justice and I do like my pressure high.

 

[Neal]

The pump should have a check valve in it as once line pressure reaches the set value, the line pressure is maintained. Pressure is maintained until water is requested that reduces line pressure below set value.

Yes, it's maintaining pressure which is causing the water to flow in reverse as well because the check valve apparently failed so water wants to flow back out the city water line.

As to the noise, it has good rubber grommets, my prior pump I put a rubber pad between the pump and the plastic faux wall Newmar mounts to. It's not really that bad, I just wish it was completely silent. I don't want to know when it's running. Then again, if I didn't know it was running I would not have caught the issue the other day with water flowing out the disconnected city water line. All is good, I just need to get a new check valve in line to prevent backflow. Easily mitigated for now.

 

[Joe Hogan]

Now I understand the issue. Thank you.

 

[Joe Hogan]

Here is a simple plumbing schematic for RV systems

 

[Neal]

Went to dump tanks and take a look for the check valve and fortunately it's right in front of my face. I also confirmed this city water line goes right into the right side of the house filter flowing right to left as I once thought.

I don't know the type of fitting used on this, in a quick Amazon search it seems it's some push connection. Not sure how easy it is to disconnect and replace. I think this item below is the replacement?

Amazon.com

I have this weird knack of ordering stuff before checking what I have! $150 of stuff coming from two places now and none of it will be used, fortunately most of it is returnable. Ugh...not the first time I've done this! My valterra coming today should work as well as the fittings but I may not have enough hose to bridge the gap. May have to reorient a few things.

 

[Neal]

In the above picture, the white hose. Does anyone know the ID/OD of that fresh water hose line?

 

[Neal]

I emailed Remco asking about the noise this pump makes and first they said Amazon is not one of their distributors (we know that) and the pump may be used, bad, or whatever. But in the dialog they also said the accumulator needs to be removed, it's not recommended inline with the pump. While all seems to be working fine, it's noisier than my Aquajet AES (3.4) and they said it should sound the same. So first step will be to remove the accumulator, if I can without removing the wet bay panel, and see how it goes, if still noisy then replace the pump. Only authorized distributors are camping world and rv upgrade store.

 

[Neal]

Accumulator tank easily bypassed as it's just unscrewing the output line from the accumulator and putting it back to the output of the water pump. Pump still cycling a bit and is a bit noisy. I remember this same thing happened when I put a 5 gpm variable speed pump in @Dutch Star Don recommended after I first got the coach. When at Newmar for warranty work they wanted to replace the pump under warranty as it was so noisy and I told them no, it's one I put in. I removed it and went with Remco AES (3.4 gpm) at that time and it worked great.

So my options now are:

1) Leave it and live with it, see what happens as the air bleeds out of the lines
2) Try another 5 gpm pump (approx $200)
3) Put the AES (3.4 gpm) pump back in which is under my bed in the spares bin

And the check valve issue is gone, water is not coming out of the city water line now. So all of those parts I ordered are going to get returned. It still shows a bad check valve so I'll likely swap that out.

Why do I get myself into these things!!! Leave it alone!

 

[Texas Clodhopper]

I was going to suggest a white noise product or foam plugs.

 

[Neal]

I think I could add more pain to the situation by removing the new ARV pump, go back to the prior AES pump, and try the accumulator with it! The problem I was trying to solve in the first place was the pulsating bathroom sink water flow. Or just leave it alone...no, I'm not capable of doing that...hmmmmm

 

[J&JD]

I think you need to add a new puppy to the mix to get your mind off all this inconsequential stuff….just sayn.

 

[newmarokie]

Neal,
is the amperage draw similar between the two pumps? Did the 5 gpm pump require any electrical mods?

 

[Neal]

Neal,
is the amperage draw similar between the two pumps? Did the 5 gpm pump require any electrical mods?

The pumps are electrically the same, or remain within RV (10A) controller limits. No mods, in fact it was a simple swap as the positive line has an inline fuse that unplugs so I could just unplug that on both and connect between the two. The black (neg) line has a spade going into the water pump controller, just had to add that on the new pump.

New pump is working fine, it just sounds different and I have to accept that, if I'm going to keep it in use. Still deciding if I want to go through the pain of putting the prior pump in or try another 5 gpm pump and see if it sounds different. Not up to any of that right now, leaving it all alone.

 

[Neal]

One thing I did different in the last pump install was put a vibration dampening (hard rubber) pad between the pump and the wall it mounts to. The new pump has reasonably sized grommets so I didn't do that and that may be part of what I'm hearing different. More of the pump noise is transferring into the plastic wall it mounts to. "Dealing with change" --

 

[newmarokie]

Thanks. I have been considering a higher volume pump for the same reasons everyone else is citing. I could really find anything on the websites about amp draw. I was also considering the pressure tank, but the variable speed pump seems to solve that.