Question Anyone rolling a Pepwave MaxTransit CAT-20 5G?

[lemondrop9344]

Neal,
Without a doubt you are a 'bleeding edge type of guy'. That's meant in a positive way, by the way.
I can understand the performance improvement of WIFI 6 in a large house. What all do you have installed in your RV that would benefit from WIFI 6?
I know I have an issue with the distribution of my WIFI signal in the RV. As my background is primarily in 'bean counting', I would look for a less expensive solution (like Peplink access points) as opposed to upgrading the heart of my RV network at roughly 7 times the cost. A Peplink AP can be had for about $200.00 vs, a MAX BR1 Pro for about $1400.00+. How can I get that through the CFO (a.k.a. the wife)?
Very few people like 'IT goodies' more than me. However, just like in the corporate world I came from, I have to put together a business case & cost justify expenditures over a certain amount. You can only ask for forgiveness, instead of permission so many times before one is put in 'time out'.
I'm living vicariously through you IT expenditures. Keep up the good work!

 

[lemondrop9344]

 

[CaptainGizmo]

This reply is supposed to be on track with this thread, even though it may seem like it’s not. Just bringing what I’ve been thinking about, to the table for this group to help me chew on.

As much of a fan of PepWave I am, I’m keeping my eye on the CradlePoint 1900 for a couple big reasons a telecom friend of mine brought to my attention.

First, the CradlePoint has multiple WiFi radios. This is a better configuration in that you won’t have the single radio trying to do AP and WAN at the same time; eventually locking up like mine did a while back.

The 1900 has dual 5G embedded modems easy to go and their price point isn’t that much higher than the same similar offering of PepWave.

To put it mildly, he is NOT a fan of the PepWave software at all. I’ve not had much complaint, and actually found the CP portal made my head spin. Granted, I wasn’t familiar with it.

To be up front, I’m also influenced by the fact that Newell is able to integrate their coach’s system with the CradlePoint that’s not possible with the PepWave.

Also, I wish I could give a better report on SpeedFusion, because that’s something PepWave really has that’s unique. I’m just not convinced that the WAN bonding and smoothing is working enough to warrant the cost.

 

[Neal]

Neal,
Without a doubt you are a 'bleeding edge type of guy'. That's meant in a positive way, by the way.
I can understand the performance improvement of WIFI 6 in a large house. What all do you have installed in your RV that would benefit from WIFI 6?
I know I have an issue with the distribution of my WIFI signal in the RV. As my background is primarily in 'bean counting', I would look for a less expensive solution (like Peplink access points) as opposed to upgrading the heart of my RV network at roughly 7 times the cost. A Peplink AP can be had for about $200.00 vs, a MAX BR1 Pro for about $1400.00+. How can I get that through the CFO (a.k.a. the wife)?
Very few people like 'IT goodies' more than me. However, just like in the corporate world I came from, I have to put together a business case & cost justify expenditures over a certain amount. You can only ask for forgiveness, instead of permission so many times before one is put in 'time out'.
I'm living vicariously through you IT expenditures. Keep up the good work!

I believe one of the strong points of WiFi 6 is more channels. Probably more important for apartment/condos but I've seen RV rallies mention WiFi concerns of channel collisions. WiFi is something that has to continue to grow and I'm glad to see it doing so. It's working well for me. For my RV I expect improved range and less interference.

 

[MapNerd]

Neal,
Without a doubt you are a 'bleeding edge type of guy'. That's meant in a positive way, by the way.
I can understand the performance improvement of WIFI 6 in a large house. What all do you have installed in your RV that would benefit from WIFI 6?
I know I have an issue with the distribution of my WIFI signal in the RV. As my background is primarily in 'bean counting', I would look for a less expensive solution (like Peplink access points) as opposed to upgrading the heart of my RV network at roughly 7 times the cost. A Peplink AP can be had for about $200.00 vs, a MAX BR1 Pro for about $1400.00+. How can I get that through the CFO (a.k.a. the wife)?
Very few people like 'IT goodies' more than me. However, just like in the corporate world I came from, I have to put together a business case & cost justify expenditures over a certain amount. You can only ask for forgiveness, instead of permission so many times before one is put in 'time out'.
I'm living vicariously through you IT expenditures. Keep up the good work!

So, there’s a couple of things to think about and consider here.

1. I am a full timer and Neal is a Most Timer, operating as a full timer for many months of the year. We’re both in software so internet speed, reliability and resiliency is more important to us and those like us than most.

2. Yes, you can purchase APs for less but your AP is only going to be as good as the modem upstream from it that is pulling down the signal. Then, with non-integrated APs, you’re likely going to take a performance hit for the latency that introduces. So let’s say you have a modem without an integrated AP and it’s managing to pull down 45mbps (not bad, not fantastic. About average). Then you have some latency between the modem and your APs, let’s say its minor and just takes you down to 40mbps. Then you have some additional latency between your client (TV, laptop, phone, etc) and the AP. Let’s say that’s minor as well and knocks your experienced speed down to 35mbps. That’s a 22% drop in what you’re pulling down vs. what you’re actually experiencing.

3. There’s an opportunity cost-benefit analysis between hardware with integrated APs vs separate APs. Namely for me, it’s less interfaces to bounce around between when managing your network. It’s not set and forget in an RV. You’re constantly tweaking and testing, every time you move and sometimes without even moving as the park churns and more/less people are trying to get signal. Less hardware results in less Interfaces and configurations, making this easier to manage. On the other hand, componetizing your deployment with separate hardware for APs gives you more configuration options and more complexity. You can probably dial it in a lot better that way and it makes it cheaper to upgrade just those components, but again if you’re moving all the time you don’t want to spend your first 3-4 hours at a campground reconfiguring your network for that location, and each component in the network can only be as good as the weakest component in the network. If that weakest component happens to be your modem that’s like upgrading your tires and expecting your car to go faster.

Ultimately, I decided to upgrade because @Neal with his CAT-18 modems experiences speeds I can only dream of with my dual CAT-12 modems. I’ve never come anywhere close to his speeds, so I am upgrading to see if I can catch him. Maybe I won’t be able to, but I shouldn’t need any new hardware going forward for at least a couple years.

 

[MapNerd]

Maybe I won’t be able to, but I shouldn’t need any new hardware going forward for at least a couple years.

Okay maybe a new antenna…

 

[lemondrop9344]

Don't know if the link below will work or not. Based on CaptainGizmo's post, I did a little poking around and found a webinar hosted by Cradlepoint on 5G technology 11/18/21. Y'all may or may not find it informative.
MapNerd is looking to upgrade his Max Transit DUO. For what it's worth, I believe Captain Gizmo's post is in the spirit of the thread.
Back when I was looking at cellular modem/routers, I considered a Cradlepoint product. Generally speaking, I found them to be a little more expensive & the lack of ability to play around with TTL was viewed as a negative by many. However, in 18 or months of usage, I've never changed the TTL on my Peplink.
In looking at the CP1900 product on the 5G store, I did not see the disclaimer with the device not being certified with Verizon. Having gone through the hassle of activating my CAT-18 prior to certification, this issue would certainly influence any purchase decision I might make with regards to a 5G product.
I normally upgrade on a 3 - 4 year cycle.

5G Now or Later? Planning Your Move

cradlepoint.com

 

[MapNerd]

Don't know if the link below will work or not. Based on CaptainGizmo's post, I did a little poking around and found a webinar hosted by Cradlepoint on 5G technology 11/18/21. Y'all may or may not find it informative.
MapNerd is looking to upgrade his Max Transit DUO. For what it's worth, I believe Captain Gizmo's post is in the spirit of the thread.
Back when I was looking at cellular modem/routers, I considered a Cradlepoint product. Generally speaking, I found them to be a little more expensive & the lack of ability to play around with TTL was viewed as a negative by many. However, in 18 or months of usage, I've never changed the TTL on my Peplink.
In looking at the CP1900 product on the 5G store, I did not see the disclaimer with the device not being certified with Verizon. Having gone through the hassle of activating my CAT-18 prior to certification, this issue would certainly influence any purchase decision I might make with regards to a 5G product.
I normally upgrade on a 3 - 4 year cycle.

5G Now or Later? Planning Your Move

cradlepoint.com

It’s important to note, non-certification doesn’t mean it won’t work, it means it hasn’t been tested and isn’t guaranteed to work. So it could work fine, it could need some TLC to make work but futzing with different configurations, or it could just not work at all with Verizon or their MVNOs.

 

[Neal]

I've never changed the TTL on my Peplink

I completely forgot about this. I just set 65 to both of mine and will run with this for a while. Speed tests remain good.

As to the Cradlepoint, we don't hear must about them. Certainly would love for those with experience with them to share, it's a viable option. I've really enjoyed the user interface of the Pepwave and think that's important for a vast majority of RVers. Pepwave does a great job putting a simple interface on top of an enterprise networking device. These devices only work as good as we configure them, sometimes we can configure them to go south quickly. I think Pepwave (Peplink's) to drop WiFi isn't a bad decision, it's very easy to add your favorite flavor of WiFi to your cellular modem. It will add to your total cost of ownership (TCO) but this is how I ran for 3 years putting a WiFi router mid ship under my dinette. The separate WiFi router solves some of the issues @CaptainGizmo pointed out. While I haven't really had the issue I am aware of it and most importantly how your config (auto channel updating) better be right or it can comm jam yourself in a heartbeat.

 

[lemondrop9344]

MapNerd,
I am also a full timer. My retirement job is providing IT support for my son's business. Reliable internet connectivity is as important to me as it is to you & Neal.
I think you will agree, as full timers with cellular modem/routers, cellular data plans are the most logical solution. Of all the cellular data plan providers, AT&T, Verizon & T-Mobile are generally considered to be the best choice. I believe it's generally acknowledged that Verizon has the best coverage nation wide, followed by AT&T with T-Mobile making inroads. That Peplink 5G devices are not yet certified for use on the Verizon network would be a deal stopper for me. Verizon is the carrier for my phones & my secondary for Peplink.
Everything you have stated with regards to integrated vs. multiple devices on a network is consistent with what I believe & have experienced. To the extent possible, I avoid WIFI on my RV network (LAN) as much as possible. I have a Peplink AP connected to a GB switch which is in turn connected to my CAT-18. The ROKU's get their WIFI signal from the Peplink AP ssid..... it never changes regardless of where the RV goes. What does change, is the availability & quality of any RV park WIFI. In those rare instances when it's good enough to use, I set it up in the Peplink to supply the ROKU's with the RV park WIFI and use if as a fail over in the event I loose my cellular signal.
As for speed test results, it's an interesting exercise. However, I've never seen xfer speeds in the Windows Task Manager, or, the Status tab of the Peplink UI that is anywhere near what I see in a speed test.

 

[lemondrop9344]

It’s important to note, non-certification doesn’t mean it won’t work, it means it hasn’t been tested and isn’t guaranteed to work. So it could work fine, it could need some TLC to make work but futzing with different configurations, or it could just not work at all with Verizon or their MVNOs.

I never said it wouldn't work & I completely agree with the above statement. I acquired my CAT-18 prior to its certification with Verizon. I was able to get it to work, but, I would have preferred to avoid the hassle. At the time, 5G hardware was not offered. 4G LTE was a good as you could get in a cellular modem/router.
5G technology, both provider side & hardware side is very new. If I were in the market to upgrade now, it would be a difficult decision.

 

[MapNerd]

I wasn’t correcting, just adding context to the conversation.

 

["EZ"]

I believe I was one of the first in here to buy the new Pepwave Max Transit 5G Cat 20 units a few months ago. I knew 5G was going to be the new thing so I didn't want to buy outdated equipment and have to replace it in a year. So, knowing the Cat 20 might be finicky I plunged ahead. My first trip to Florida was stressful because my wife HAD TO HAVE a good connection because she didn't take off work she just trusted that I could get her "on-line" so she could do her job and not get fired. LOL. Turns out T-Mobile did a pretty good job connecting with 5G in most places. The AT&T 5G sim card I bought never showed anything but 3G the whole trip and wouldn't connect 95% of the time. In fairness, AT&T had not "approved" the 5G set up yet and I can attest that it didn't work worth a crap! I have not tried Verizon but they also said they were not 5G approved so I would only guess it would act about like my AT&T sim card did. I love the Pepwave unit and I hope the sim card carriers catch up to the technology but for now it's hit or miss depending on where you are and which carrier you are using. At this time I could only recommend T-Mobile because they were ready for the 5G connection. Hope this helps!

 

["EZ"]

BTW..............I was only using the paddle antennas. I have not taken the time to hook up the 7-1 Poyntang antenna outside. Not sure if this would have made a difference in the AT&T sim performance since it showed 3G the entire time I was in Florida. But the T-Mobile sim card was at 5G and showing 70-90 download speeds.

 

[lemondrop9344]

Neal,
With regards to TTL. I found this explaining what it is/was:

TTL stands for Time To Live. When a TCP packet is sent, its TTL is set, which is the number of routers (hops) it can pass through before the packet is discarded. ... Trace Route works by setting the TTL for a packet to 1, sending it towards the requested destination host, and listening for the reply.

I've searched, off & on, to see if I find any information on how this setting would impact connectivity with a cellular modem/router.






TTL Behavior of Labeled Packets > MPLS Fundamentals: Forwarding Labeled Packets | Cisco Press

 

[lemondrop9344]

This was posted on the Peplink Forum about 4 hours ago.
Given we are in November, their estimated ETA's for most of the 5G products on the list might be a tad questionable.

 

[MapNerd]

 

[lemondrop9344]

Love it!

 

[MapNerd]

Well I got a Pepwave Max BR1 Pro 5G CAT-20 unit and if I haven’t caught up to @Neal’s download speeds yet, he must be dragging a fiber optic cable behind his rig

 

[redbaron]

View attachment 9865
Well I got a Pepwave Max BR1 Pro 5G CAT-20 unit and if I haven’t caught up to @Neal’s download speeds yet, he must be dragging a fiber optic cable behind his rig

I just received mine from Santa Neal today too. Haven't opened the box yet.

Let me know what antenna you decide on. Was going to order pepwave, but then the parsac conversation started, so I am holding.

I use the pepwave wifi as a client only. My Lan wifi system is separate. Still want a 7 in one on the roof for this modem, and my cat 6 redundant will be in the mid bath.