Question Walk through for preparing a vehicle for flat towing

[Hillman]

Is there somewhere I can go for a walkthrough on everything I'd need to do to my 2016 Dodge Grand caravan to prepare it for flat towing behind a class C? We were going to go with a dolly, but I've been told if you get into a situation where you need to back up, you have to disconnect first, but not so with a flat tow? And it has to be the Dodge as our other vehicle is a Jeep Renegade which apparently you can't flat tow OR tow with a dolly.

So, what do I need to do to my van? What do I need to buy, have installed, etc? Thanks. This is part of our summer around the US trip this year and with a Class C on a 450 chassis we think this is doable, unless I'm wrong there too? Thank you.

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

The first thing to check is whether the 2016 Dodge Grand Caravan is actually flat-towable at all. From my limited research (2016 Guide to Dinghy Towing*), it does not appear to be. Not all vehicles are capable of being flat-towed, as you have observed with your Jeep. As with any endeavor, if you throw enough money at a problem, you can resolve it.

Most vehicles can be modified for flat towing with driveshaft disconnects, transmission lubrication pumps, etc. but the cost would be high. And, some vehicles can’t even be modified for flat- or dolly-towing; they need to be on a trailer.

The second thing you need to check is the Grand Caravan’s weight. Again, from my limited research, it would appear to be in the 4,300-4,500 pound range. That’s quite a bit to tow behind most Class Cs.

From my perspective, your 2016 Dodge Grand Caravan is not a good choice for a towed vehicle.

As for not being able to back up a vehicle on a dolly, the same is true for flat-towed vehicle. You would need to unhook either way.

* https://www.roadmasterinc.com/pdf/dtg_2016.pdf

TJ

 

[Hillman]

The first thing to check is whether the 2016 Dodge Grand Caravan is actually flat-towable at all. From my limited research (2016 Guide to Dinghy Towing*), it does not appear to be. Not all vehicles are capable of being flat-towed, as you have observed with your Jeep. As with any endeavor, if you throw enough money at a problem, you can resolve it.

Most vehicles can be modified for flat towing with driveshaft disconnects, transmission lubrication pumps, etc. but the cost would be high. And, some vehicles can’t even be modified for flat- or dolly-towing; they need to be on a trailer.

The second thing you need to check is the Grand Caravan’s weight. Again, from my limited research, it would appear to be in the 4,300-4,500 pound range. That’s quite a bit to tow behind most Class Cs.

From my perspective, your 2016 Dodge Grand Caravan is not a good choice for a towed vehicle.

As for not being able to back up a vehicle on a dolly, the same is true for flat-towed vehicle. You would need to unhook either way.

* https://www.roadmasterinc.com/pdf/dtg_2016.pdf

TJ

I've no interest in flat towing if it offers no advantage in backing up over a dolly, so that's fine, and I know that I have to have a Class C that is rated for a 5000lb hitch, as well as the 5000lb receiver, and then an empty van. But thank you, those are important things to be thinking about. At least now I can forget the flat tow/vs dolly question.

 

["EZ"]

I don't think you can back up more than about 10 feet with a tow dolly or a tow bar for flat towing either one. I backed up my 40' pusher with a Blue Ox tow bar towing my Jeep Grand Cherokee. It only went about 10 feet before it started to jack knife. I would imagine a tow dolly would be about the same. One thing is for sure. It makes you plan ahead when you pull off the interstate on an exit. You don't want to have to back up because it's a pain!!

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

I don't think you can back up more than about 10 feet with a tow dolly or a tow bar for flat towing either one. I backed up my 40' pusher with a Blue Ox tow bar towing my Jeep Grand Cherokee. It only went about 10 feet before it started to jack knife. I would imagine a tow dolly would be about the same. One thing is for sure. It makes you plan ahead when you pull off the interstate on an exit. You don't want to have to back up because it's a pain!!

The RV tech who installed our tow system on the Honda CR-V told me that if I backed it up more than 4 feet, I’d better have money in the bank because it would do several thousand dollars damage to the toad. Not sure how accurate that was, but I haven’t wanted to test his hypothesis.

TJ

 

["EZ"]

The RV tech who installed our tow system on the Honda CR-V told me that if I backed it up more than 4 feet, I’d better have money in the bank because it would do several thousand dollars damage to the toad. Not sure how accurate that was, but I haven’t wanted to test his hypothesis.

TJ

He didn't say what would break?

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

He didn't say what would break?

I didn’t question him specifically, but it sounded like suspension damage and driveline issues (it is an AWD CR-V). Haven’t really had the need to back up as I’m pretty careful about looking ahead to anticipate potential sticky situations.

TJ

 

[Hillman]

seems like now we're going to have to adjust our plans and look for a smaller class C or a Class A that fits our budget but can tow more, I guess.

 

[MapNerd]

According to page 570 of the 2016 Dodge Grand Caravan owners manual I was able to find online, which covers recreational towing behind a motorhome, the 2016 Dodge Grand Caravan is only towable on a dolly or trailer, regardless of model. You can never flat tow it (all four wheels on the ground). If you choose to dolly tow, your front wheels must be on the dolly and rear wheels on the ground.

DO NOT reverse this and place your rear wheels on the dolly and front wheels on the ground as your vehicle is FWD and this will cause substantial damage to your drivetrain, specifically your transmission.

as to what you need to do:
1. Determine whether you want to dolly tow or trailer tow - sounds like you’ve made this decision already
2. Find a suitable dolly or trailer capable of towing your Grand Caravan. In addition to being able to support and tow your vehicle, a suitable dolly should have its own dedicated, supplemental lighting and braking system, this way your towed vehicle can be completely powered off and when being towed. I might consider the Roadmaster RM-2000-1.
3. Read and understand your dolly or trailer towing procedures as well as your vehicles. When towing on a dolly or trailer, little to no modifications should need to be made to your tow vehicle. The dolly or trailer should be doing all of the tow work and your vehicle is just along for the ride with just a couple of steps to put it into the proper tow-mode configuration.

as to backing up, avoid it at all costs unless
1. You are Trailer towing - it’s okay to back up then (trailer towing and dolly towing are NOT the same thing. Do not back up when dolly towing). If not trailer towing and the turn is too tight and you think you might get stuck, don’t do it. There is always another, safer way to get there (usually 5-10 minutes down the road or less) that you can use to get reoriented without causing substantial damage and blocking an intersection for 20 minutes.
2. Someone is dying
3. Something is on fire
4. You really like making expensive repairs

 

[Hillman]

According to page 570 of the 2016 Dodge Grand Caravan owners manual I was able to find online, which covers recreational towing behind a motorhome, the 2016 Dodge Grand Caravan is only towable on a dolly or trailer, regardless of model. You can never flat tow it (all four wheels on the ground). If you choose to dolly tow, your front wheels must be on the dolly and rear wheels on the ground.

DO NOT reverse this and place your rear wheels on the dolly and front wheels on the ground as your vehicle is FWD and this will cause substantial damage to your drivetrain, specifically your transmission.

as to what you need to do:
1. Determine whether you want to dolly tow or trailer tow - sounds like you’ve made this decision already
2. Find a suitable dolly or trailer capable of towing your Grand Caravan. In addition to being able to support and tow your vehicle, a suitable dolly should have its own dedicated, supplemental lighting and braking system, this way your towed vehicle can be completely powered off and when being towed. I might consider the Roadmaster RM-2000-1.
3. Read and understand your dolly or trailer towing procedures as well as your vehicles. When towing on a dolly or trailer, little to no modifications should need to be made to your tow vehicle. The dolly or trailer should be doing all of the tow work and your vehicle is just along for the ride with just a couple of steps to put it into the proper tow-mode configuration.

as to backing up, avoid it at all costs unless
1. You are Trailer towing - it’s okay to back up then (trailer towing and dolly towing are NOT the same thing. Do not back up when dolly towing). If not trailer towing and the turn is too tight and you think you might get stuck, don’t do it. There is always another, safer way to get there (usually 5-10 minutes down the road or less) that you can use to get reoriented without causing substantial damage and blocking an intersection for 20 minutes.
2. Someone is dying
3. Something is on fire
4. You really like making expensive repairs

Thank you, that's a lot of good information. Boy those dollies aren't cheap, if you want a good one. This trip we are planning for, and subsequent trips in the years coming that generate from what we do now, has evolved from "Hey, let's buy a camper and head west for the summer" to wavering between a Class C, truck and trailer combo, back to class C with a towed vehicle, then back to truck and trailer combo, to maybe a very small Class C and no tow vehicle, OR a Class A with a greater towing capacity and a towed vehicle. It's become far more complicated than we anticipated because we do have a budget so as not to affect our bottom line anywhere else. At some points, the complications have become disheartening, because we want to do it right. In the past, we bought an older, heavy trailer and pulled it with a Yukon and it was punishing on me, and both vehicles because I didn't understand towing capacity, hitch weight, cargo capacity, all of that, and we want to do this one right so we can continue doing it right for a very long time. I appreciate all of the help.

 

[MapNerd]

Whether you flat tow, trailer tow or dolly tow, you’re going to spend approximately the same amount on a setup. With dolly towing, as you’ve now seen, the bulk of the expense will be on the dolly. The same goes for a trailer. Flat towing, you’ll be spending on the additional equipment you need to add to your vehicle so that you can tow it, assuming the vehcile is towable in this manner. Yours is not.

there are cheaper tow dollys and trailers out there. I just have a personal preference for Roadmaster’s products.

to me personally, dolly towing makes the least sense. If you trailer tow, you still have to buy a trailer and that can cost about the same as a good dolly, but with a trailer you can back up. When you get to a compaground, dolly or trailer, you need a place to stash the gear. Not all campgrounds have overflow parking for this so sometimes that means your own site. That is really the only scenario where a a dolly is better than a trailer in my opinion. With flat towing, you avoid the need to stash any gear but you can’t back up and you’ll be adding a few aftermarket components to your vehicle.

it’s important that you take your time, consider the options and decide what’s right for you and your situation. The correct answer - all of them when it comes to RVing - are different for everyone because our situations are all slightly different.

good luck and don’t be afraid to ask more questions

 

[Joe Hogan]

We use a Demco dolly, towing a VW Passat sedan. Backing up with the Passat on the Dolly does not work well or for very far but a short distance in a pinch is helpful.
Backing up with the Dolly empty is relatively simple. Typically I unload the sedan and back the Dolly into a back in campsite.(Prefer drive thru campsites leaving the car on the Dolly but back in works)
We have used this combination for over three years and 25k. Works well.

Given the choice I'd prefer a Flat Tow. Just have not been able to determine a good setup that works for me.

 

[Hillman]

Whether you flat tow, trailer tow or dolly tow, you’re going to spend approximately the same amount on a setup. With dolly towing, as you’ve now seen, the bulk of the expense will be on the dolly. The same goes for a trailer. Flat towing, you’ll be spending on the additional equipment you need to add to your vehicle so that you can tow it, assuming the vehcile is towable in this manner. Yours is not.

there are cheaper tow dollys and trailers out there. I just have a personal preference for Roadmaster’s products.

to me personally, dolly towing makes the least sense. If you trailer tow, you still have to buy a trailer and that can cost about the same as a good dolly, but with a trailer you can back up. When you get to a compaground, dolly or trailer, you need a place to stash the gear. Not all campgrounds have overflow parking for this so sometimes that means your own site. That is really the only scenario where a a dolly is better than a trailer in my opinion. With flat towing, you avoid the need to stash any gear but you can’t back up and you’ll be adding a few aftermarket components to your vehicle.

it’s important that you take your time, consider the options and decide what’s right for you and your situation. The correct answer - all of them when it comes to RVing - are different for everyone because our situations are all slightly different.

good luck and don’t be afraid to ask more questions

While cost between dolly and trailer towing may be similar, the trailers I've looked at weigh about 1,000lbs or more over the Dolly, and if I'm looking at a 5000lb hitch, and a 4500lb van, I'm already pushing or passing my limit. I've removed three of the four rear seats of the van to save some weight, but no way can I shave a thousand pounds off from it. Gas tank only 1/3 full even. So with a Class A with a 5000lb hitch, I'm relegated to a light dolly if I want to tow my Grand Caravan. However, to tow my wife's Jeep Renegade, which is 1,000lbs less than my van, I might be able to trailer tow it. But even then, 3500lbs empty for the Jeep, plus 1500lbs for the trailer is right at the edge. After spending weeks trying to figure this out, I don't understand how I see so many people towing with their RVs. Am I just worrying too much? Or are they all upgrading their hitches? I saw a Class C pulling an F150 on a trailer this summer. Flat towing is out for my vehicles, which is fine. But it's either dolly tow my DGC or trailer tow the Renegade at this point. Our budget doesn't allow us to trade either of those vehicles right now, not if we want to keep to our financial plans.

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

Sadly, many of the RVs you see towing or being towed are doing so unsafely. They get away with it (until they don’t) and feel like everything is fine. Someone recently posted a link to an article (I couldn’t find it in a quick search) that claimed 50% of the RVs towing or being towed fell into the unsafe category. When people do that, they put themselves, their families and all others sharing the road with them at risk. I commend you for wanting to do it right. Thank you!

Unfortunately, we sometimes find ourselves in a position where ”doing it right” doesn’t mesh with the reality of the moment and we need to put things on hold. Given the combination of things you’ve mentioned, you may need to adjust your plans for the time being. Going with a smaller Class C and not towing a car is doable. Is it always convenient? No! But it can work and lots of folks do it. You can even rent a Class C to do that.

Given your vehicle situation and budget concerns, towing a lightweight pop-up (aka “tent”) trailer behind the Caravan might also be an option. Where there’s a will, there’s a way. And, again, thanks for being concerned enough to seek advice and do things right.

TJ

 

[Hillman]

Sadly, many of the RVs you see towing or being towed are doing so unsafely. They get away with it (until they don’t) and feel like everything is fine. Someone recently posted a link to an article (I couldn’t find it in a quick search) that claimed 50% of the RVs towing or being towed fell into the unsafe category. When people do that, they put themselves, their families and all others sharing the road with them at risk. I commend you for wanting to do it right. Thank you!

Unfortunately, we sometimes find ourselves in a position where ”doing it right” doesn’t mesh with the reality of the moment and we need to put things on hold. Given the combination of things you’ve mentioned, you may need to adjust your plans for the time being. Going with a smaller Class C and not towing a car is doable. Is it always convenient? No! But it can work and lots of folks do it. You can even rent a Class C to do that.

Given your vehicle situation and budget concerns, towing a lightweight pop-up (aka “tent”) trailer behind the Caravan might also be an option. Where there’s a will, there’s a way. And, again, thanks for being concerned enough to seek advice and do things right.

TJ

Thanks. While our budget can be adjusted, it needs to be done judiciously. This year is the perfect time, in our long term plan, for making this trip, so we WILL make it work, it's just balancing comfort, safety, fun, $$$, and what we want from our equipment for the future. I am looking heavily at all options. I know I can do it right at the limit of safety, but I'm trying to play it a little more conservatively than that. I know much more this time around than a few years back when we just bought a trailer off CL, hitched it up, and went. Definately didn't do it right that time.

 

[Hillman]

We use a Demco dolly, towing a VW Passat sedan. Backing up with the Passat on the Dolly does not work well or for very far but a short distance in a pinch is helpful.
Backing up with the Dolly empty is relatively simple. Typically I unload the sedan and back the Dolly into a back in campsite.(Prefer drive thru campsites leaving the car on the Dolly but back in works)
We have used this combination for over three years and 25k. Works well.

Given the choice I'd prefer a Flat Tow. Just have not been able to determine a good setup that works for me.

My concern was I heard you can't back up at all. So not even a nudge, if I have to readjust? Then I see maybe 10 feet, maybe a couple feet. I'm fine with that, really. I can live with swooping around when I screw up too much. I don't need to back anything up a long ways, I just didn't understand if you could back up like a foot or two in a pinch. Thanks.

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

My concern was I heard you can't back up at all. So not even a nudge, if I have to readjust? Then I see maybe 10 feet, maybe a couple feet. I'm fine with that, really. I can live with swooping around when I screw up too much. I don't need to back anything up a long ways, I just didn't understand if you could back up like a foot or two in a pinch. Thanks.

You “probably” can back up a foot or two without an issue; “maybe” 5-10 feet in a pinch. “Probably” and “maybe” are the operative words here. I’m sure the dolly and tow bar manufacturers are being conservative with their recommendations for liability reasons. So, you “probably” don’t need to live in fear of having the dolly/towed vehicle back up a foot or two but the recommendation is to not make a practice of it.

That said, if damage were to occur to the towed or towing vehicle because you backed it up, just understand that no one but you will be “responsible.” Life is full of choices and each one needs to be measured before making it.

Please also understand that when you ask for guidance or recommendations on RVF, those of us who respond feel obligated to give you the best advice we can. We all want to see more folks enjoy the RV lifestyle and never like telling someone something they really don’t want to hear. However, if we didn’t give you the benefit of our experience in an honest way, we would be doing people a disservice.

Good luck on making the right choice for you and your family.

TJ

 

[Hillman]

You “probably” can back up a foot or two without an issue; “maybe” 5-10 feet in a pinch. “Probably” and “maybe” are the operative words here. I’m sure the dolly and tow bar manufacturers are being conservative with their recommendations for liability reasons. So, you “probably” don’t need to live in fear of having the dolly/towed vehicle back up a foot or two but the recommendation is to not make a practice of it.

That said, if damage were to occur to the towed or towing vehicle because you backed it up, just understand that no one but you will be “responsible.” Life is full of choices and each one needs to be measured before making it.

Please also understand that when you ask for guidance or recommendations on RVF, those of us who respond feel obligated to give you the best advice we can. We all want to see more folks enjoy the RV lifestyle and never like telling someone something they really don’t want to hear. However, if we didn’t give you the benefit of our experience in an honest way, we would be doing people a disservice.

Good luck on making the right choice for you and your family.

TJ

I absolutely appreciate the honest answers from folks with experience.

 

[CaptainGizmo]

My concern was I heard you can't back up at all. So not even a nudge, if I have to readjust? Then I see maybe 10 feet, maybe a couple feet. I'm fine with that, really. I can live with swooping around when I screw up too much. I don't need to back anything up a long ways, I just didn't understand if you could back up like a foot or two in a pinch. Thanks.

Here’s the problem with backing up with a FLAT TOW...
It’s all about “caster”. When a vehicle is pushed backwards, the front wheels will immediately flip to one side. Yes, I’ve tried it, and I couldn’t back up more than a couple feet before it happened.

The caster angle is set for forward travel. Even if a car is allowed to freely roll backwards, the wheels will have a tendency to turn. But, when being pushed, it amplifies the force, because the TOAD isn’t able to go in the path dictated by the wheels; instead, it’s forced by the tow-bar. So, the damage is likely to be at the weakest link, probably the tow-bar struts. I’m sure the front-end of the TOAD won’t be happy either, but I kinda doubt it would break before the tow-bar. But that’s not the point.

Our “emergency plan” is something I’ve never heard anyone talk about, other than from utter non-sense. IF we have to back up, with my TOAD (Raptor), the plan will be to start it in order to give power to the steering, then have my wife HOLD THE STEERING IN PLACE as I back up. HER job is to HOLD the steering just as it is. And MY job is to not make any radical turn changes with the coach. This will allow the coach and TOAD to back up in the same line and shouldn’t cause any problem.

I know this was a bit off the question of towing, but since you had a concern about backing up, I thought it would help to hear my thoughts.

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

Here’s the problem with backing up with a FLAT TOW...
It’s all about “caster”. When a vehicle is pushed backwards, the front wheels will immediately flip to one side. Yes, I’ve tried it, and I couldn’t back up more than a couple feet before it happened.

The caster angle is set for forward travel. Even if a car is allowed to freely roll backwards, the wheels will have a tendency to turn. But, when being pushed, it amplifies the force, because the TOAD isn’t able to go in the path dictated by the wheels; instead, it’s forced by the tow-bar. So, the damage is likely to be at the weakest link, probably the tow-bar struts. I’m sure the front-end of the TOAD won’t be happy either, but I kinda doubt it would break before the tow-bar. But that’s not the point.

Our “emergency plan” is something I’ve never heard anyone talk about, other than from utter non-sense. IF we have to back up, with my TOAD (Raptor), the plan will be to start it in order to give power to the steering, then have my wife HOLD THE STEERING IN PLACE as I back up. HER job is to HOLD the steering just as it is. And MY job is to not make any radical turn changes with the coach. This will allow the coach and TOAD to back up in the same line and shouldn’t cause any problem.

I know this was a bit off the question of towing, but since you had a concern about backing up, I thought it would help to hear my thoughts.

Excellent point, @CaptainGizmo! This is our unsaid policy as well. Further, our plan includes having the toad driver put it in reverse and gently apply a little throttle to keep rearward tension on the tow bar.

TJ