2019 Tahoe Towing Guidance

[baare657]

My wife has expressed an interest in an RV travel trailer. I'm curious of the capability of our current equipment, as well as some information and experience you folks have had in your endeavors:
2019 Tahoe
5.3L V8
Axle ratio 3.08
Standard trailering package (not the max trailering package).

Please bear with me while I set this up:

Dealer's keep telling me "it is specified to tow up to 6400 lbs". I think they got the number with some math of the available specs:
GCVR : 12000
GVWR: 7300
Curb: 5602

GCVR - curb = ~6400 (rounded up)

I weighed my Tahoe, full tank with kids seats and other daily crap, no passengers:
actual curb : 5641

As an experiment, I picked a trailer with a dry weight of 4698: Grand Design Imagine XLS 21BHE

After weighing some travel items and doing some calculations, I think i am still within specs:
Vehicle Capacity : (GVWR - (Curb + tahoe payload + tongue)) > 0
After calculations, this equation comes to : 340.9lbs to spare (within spec)

Towing Capacity: (GCWR - (Curb + tahoe payload + trailer UVR + trailer payload)) > 0
After calculations, this equation comes to: 52.9lbs to spare ( i can move some things around to get this number closer to 300 lbs)

I've had difficulty finding anyone at the dealership who is willing to have a technical discussion.
We love the mountains, and would like to set up camp there.

I've tried to remain conservative, but the question remains:
Without the max trailering package (increasing capacity by 2K), assuming I remain within the specs, is this a safe, legal and practical endeavor?
Anyone out there with similar specs who tows a comparable camper?
Aside from a trailer brake controller, any other must-have additions?
What do have in your RV when you tow?

I've attached my spreadsheet, feel free to tell me i'm an idiot, but please tell me why as well. I'm well aware that i cut twice and say "its still too short!".
Thanks in advance. I've already learned alot reading through these posts.
-mb

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

I'm not sure how either you or the dealer arrived at your numbers. GCVWR is 12,000, GVWR of Tahoe is 7,300. GCVWR - GVWR = rated tow capacity and 80% of the computed "rated tow capacity" is considered maximum safe towing capacity.

"Curb" isn't a recognized rating as far as I know. If it relates to an empty vehicle, then you need to add the weight of fuel, passengers, cargo, etc. which is what GVWR tells you. Dealers frequently don't know (and/or don't want you to know) what the real tow ratings are.

So, GCVWR - GVWR x .80 gives you a generally recognized safe towing capacity.

(12,000 - 7,300) x .80 = 3,760

Unless I am misunderstanding something, I would say your proposed scenario doesn't work. Remember, safe towing capacity is more than how much you can pull. It also relates to how much you can safely stop, control, etc. Axle ratios are meaningless in that scenario.

TJ

 

[baare657]

I'm not sure how either you or the dealer arrived at your numbers. GCVWR is 12,000, GVWR of Tahoe is 7,300. GCVWR - GVWR = rated tow capacity and 80% of the computed "rated tow capacity" is considered maximum safe towing capacity.

"Curb" isn't a recognized rating as far as I know. If it relates to an empty vehicle, then you need to add the weight of fuel, passengers, cargo, etc. which is what GVWR tells you. Dealers frequently don't know (and/or don't want you to know) what the real tow ratings are.

So, GCVWR - GVWR x .80 gives you a generally recognized safe towing capacity.

(12,000 - 7,300) x .80 = 3,760

Unless I am misunderstanding something, I would say your proposed scenario doesn't work. Remember, safe towing capacity is more than how much you can pull. It also relates to how much you can safely stop, control, etc. Axle ratios are meaningless in that scenario.

TJ

Outstanding, that's exactly what I was looking for. Thanks TJ.
Is there an industry standard or a standards body that dictates the rated vs maximum safe towing capacity? or is this more tribal knowledge/common sense?
I arrived at these numbers after discussing with Chevy dealers, RV dealers, youtube and google. Example, "2019 Chevrolet Tailoring guide"

Very good point about what dealers don't want you to know. Its been impossible to get anyone who works in any capacity with Chevrolet to have a technical discussion with me.

This tells me we need to upgrade our vehicle to tow an RV that would be useful for my family. thanks again,
-Matt

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

Outstanding, that's exactly what I was looking for. Thanks TJ.
Is there an industry standard or a standards body that dictates the rated vs maximum safe towing capacity? or is this more tribal knowledge/common sense?
I arrived at these numbers after discussing with Chevy dealers, RV dealers, youtube and google. Example, "2019 Chevrolet Tailoring guide"

Very good point about what dealers don't want you to know. Its been impossible to get anyone who works in any capacity with Chevrolet to have a technical discussion with me.

This tells me we need to upgrade our vehicle to tow an RV that would be useful for my family. thanks again,
-Matt

Hi, Matt.

The 80% figure is a combination of common sense and good engineering practice. It is based on the thought that it is never good engineering practice to load any mechanical device at its maximum rated capacity as that leaves no room for error. Now, one can argue that the vehicle weigh ratings (GWR, GCVWR, etc.) have some "overhead" built into them but you have to establish some base level from which to do extrapolations. The 80% factor has become generally accepted among many RVers. That certainly doesn't mean that if you load something to 85% of rated capacity bad things will always happen.

The other issue with the Tahoe and other similar vehicles is that they have a relatively short wheelbase. This can exacerbate any handling issues. A longer wheelbase truck smooths things out.

Good luck with your search.

TJ

 

["EZ"]

I'm not sure how either you or the dealer arrived at your numbers. GCVWR is 12,000, GVWR of Tahoe is 7,300. GCVWR - GVWR = rated tow capacity and 80% of the computed "rated tow capacity" is considered maximum safe towing capacity.

"Curb" isn't a recognized rating as far as I know. If it relates to an empty vehicle, then you need to add the weight of fuel, passengers, cargo, etc. which is what GVWR tells you. Dealers frequently don't know (and/or don't want you to know) what the real tow ratings are.

So, GCVWR - GVWR x .80 gives you a generally recognized safe towing capacity.

(12,000 - 7,300) x .80 = 3,760

Unless I am misunderstanding something, I would say your proposed scenario doesn't work. Remember, safe towing capacity is more than how much you can pull. It also relates to how much you can safely stop, control, etc. Axle ratios are meaningless in that scenario.

TJ

One slight correction here. The rear axle ratio DOES play a very important part in determining the GCWR which would effect your towing capacity. This is not important for a Tahoe because they may only offer one ratio. But in a 2500/3500 pickup there offer at least 3 ratios. Here is how it effects the Ram 2500/3500 GCWR with the Cummins engine and the Aisen auto transmission................
3.42 25,300 lbs
3.42 29,300 lbs
3.73 33,800 lbs
4.10 39,100 lbs

This comes from my Ram pocket guide for Towing and Payload. Not sure why the 3.42 has 2 different ratings. I'd have to do some more digging. I'm assuming the 3.42 is available with the smaller Chrysler built transmission or it's a SRW rather than a DRW axle.

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

One slight correction here. The rear axle ratio DOES play a very important part in determining the GCWR which would effect your towing capacity. This is not important for a Tahoe because they may only offer one ratio. But in a 2500/3500 pickup there offer at least 3 ratios. Here is how it effects the Ram 2500/3500 GCWR with the Cummins engine and the Aisen auto transmission................
3.42 25,300 lbs
3.42 29,300 lbs
3.73 33,800 lbs
4.10 39,100 lbs

This comes from my Ram pocket guide for Towing and Payload. Not sure why the 3.42 has 2 different ratings. I'd have to do some more digging. I'm assuming the 3.42 is available with the smaller Chrysler built transmission or it's a SRW rather than a DRW axle.

You are correct that the axle ratio plays a role in determining GCVWR, but only from the standpoint of how much you can pull safely. It doesn't play a role in the ability to stop (OK...maybe a very tiny part theoretically) or in handling. My point was that choosing a different axle ratio doesn't really alter what the vehicle can safely tow, all things considered.

TJ

 

[Kevin D Pem]

The 80% figure is a combination of common sense and good engineering practice. It is based on the thought that it is never good engineering practice to load any mechanical device at its maximum rated capacity as that leaves no room for error. Now, one can argue that the vehicle weigh ratings (GWR, GCVWR, etc.) have some "overhead" built into them but you have to establish some base level from which to do extrapolations. The 80% factor has become generally accepted among many RVers. That certainly doesn't mean that if you load something to 85% of rated capacity bad things will always happen.

Max rated capacity is in fact the max the vehicle can deal with, no fudge room. All things related to this include cooling system, brake heat build up, transmission heat and anything involved in the vehicle as a system. Braking of the load is only vehicle and 2000 lbs trailer, the rest is figured to be stopped by trailer brakes. Question this? Try stopping the load with trailer brakes disconnected.

The size not ratio of the rear end is what is important for tow capacity as the gears will break if overloaded, the axle may bend and produce miss alignment of gears and bearings. But this rating, again is max load rating, don't go fast through a bump.

durability and the amount of time one can haul the max is typically limited by something called duty cycle. Most of the time fully loaded machinery of any form has a duty cycle of 50%. Although this duty cycle can work for short distances and may shorten equipment life, it will not work for long distances. The number of grade will change the duty cycle, as the rated capacity is on level ground. To obtain a useful duty cycle we call for 80% towing capacity. This too is on level ground and considers fuel stops on the 20gal gas stop (or whatever standard tank is for your vehicle) as a cool down period. In other words at 80% weight capacity we are not at 100% duty cycle but If we consider the stops along the way it works. When you see a Truck/trailer combo on a hill with the hood up you are seeing what happens when we are overloaded or pushing duty cycle because of a hill/whatever.

In summary even if we load at 80% gcvw we can be missing the mark on the duty cycle, and have problems we thought we shouldn't have based on manufacturer numbers. At some point the user has to take responsibility to assure reliable operation of the machinery. This responsibility included understanding the numbers based on duty cycle, and watch the system indicators(temp gauges) and keep the systems at the proper limits by slowing on hills if required, lower duty cycle in high temperature areas, or using lower gears in heavy traffic when needed. I call this babying the rig.

 

["EZ"]

My point was that choosing a different axle ratio doesn't really alter what the vehicle can safely tow, all things considered.

TJ

With all due respect, you need to keep this advice to yourself. It is incorrect. I just showed you the Engineering data where the axel ratio can change the towing capacity from 25,300 lbs. to 39,100 lbs. IN THE SAME TRUCK! If a person that doesn't know any better goes into a dealership and asks the salesman "what about the axle ratio" and the salesman says "the axel ratio doesn't really alter what the vehicle can safely tow" (your words) he could be sending the guy down the road in a new truck that is dangerously incapable of towing the fifth wheel he is planning to buy because he was told the axel ratio doesn't really matter. There is enough misinformation in the market place already without telling people the axle ratio doesn't really alter what the vehicle can safely tow. It matters a great deal. I've been spec'ing commercial trucks out for various applications for 30 years. I actually sold chassis into the TOWING and Recovery industry for 15 of those years. I know a thing or two about truck spec's and towing. Sorry for the rant................now back to your regularly scheduled broadcast.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

With all due respect, you need to keep this advice to yourself. It is incorrect. I just showed you the Engineering data where the axel ratio can change the towing capacity from 25,300 lbs. to 39,100 lbs. IN THE SAME TRUCK! If a person that doesn't know any better goes into a dealership and asks the salesman "what about the axle ratio" and the salesman says "the axel ratio doesn't really alter what the vehicle can safely tow"

Hey @"EZ" I understand from where you are coming. Other than very large trucks most of the time under powered for the size and capacity I would think. Gear ratio in the rear end pumpkin has little to do with the weak link of the system. It does have a lot to do with tow power however. When you spec a truck for a load I would think the table takes into account the life of universal joints, twisted drive shafts and pinions asked to do more than they should. The compromise of low gears in today's world are transmissions with overdrive, last 2.5 ton truck I drove had a two speed rear end, now days the over drive is the answer. Good off the line power because of the almost 4:1 ratio and low RPM because of the over drive gears, that must be locked out or trans failure is soon to come.

No matter what the gear ratio in the rear end, HP determines the high end speed, because the HP is the figure that determines the speed that the work can be done. The gear ratio and torque determine that it can be done HP is moot at the first gear reduction, it is then torque.

You sell a lot of trucks for commercial customers. I will let you know that when I bought my truck at Downtown Dodge in Vernal UT. I asked for the tow capacity of the truck. The salesman (sales manager in my case) pulled up the VIN and the answer was right there on the spec page for my future truck as built. So my answer was from an engineers data sheet like you showed us in your post. For the rest of you it is good to ask for this info before you buy. It is not that the information is not there. It is not that they want to hide it from you. Quite frankly it is because your salesman is to lazy to do his job, if he won't look it up for you. Find another dealer if they won't work with you.

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

With all due respect, you need to keep this advice to yourself. It is incorrect.

Looks like we need to agree to disagree and move on. ?

TJ

 

[baare657]

This has been a very good learning experience for me. Thanks everyone for sharing. I'll try my best to summarize:
Just considering GCWR/GVWR, this experiment has a result far too close to the maximums for parts stress and maintenance.
When considering towing capacity, I need to pay attention to other specs, such as axle ratio, and combine them in my decision to haul/what to haul. This axle ratio is not designed for hauling, more for daily driving.
Even if I arrive within the 80% margin, i need to understand the duty cycle (heating up vs cooling down periods to maintain serviceability) and keep an eye on various gauges to understand when/if i'm approaching the edge of the duty cycle (ready for a cooldown period).

One more thing that popped up is the effect wheel base and trailer length have on stability. Brake controller, weight distribution hitch and sway control seem to be a must. Do you factor in the wheelbase in selecting a trailer length?

I understand this is an RV thread, so i'll try to stay away from towing vehicle specifics (or maybe that can be covered here).
Do any of you have any opinion on aftermarket parts, for example:

• Brake controller
• Axle oil cooling

I don't like adding or changing things to deviate from the factory designed and extensively tested technical specs, but I don't know how invasive that is, nor the downstream effects.

Thanks everyone for sharing, I really appreciate it.

 

["EZ"]

baare657,
I suggest you go here and read this very informative article about towing trailers. Click here: Towing, Payload, & GCVWR: What's It All Mean? | Top Speed

Here is a quote from the article:
"The first thing to understand is truckmakers publish the absolute maximum a truck can pull when its equipped just so with the correct powertrain options, suspension setups, and towing packages. Drop by a local dealership and pick a random truck off the lot and it’s highly likely it won’t be equipped to handle the advertised trailer weight.

What’s more, even with a truck that’s actually equipped with all the right gear for maximum towing, there are still aftermarket parts like weight-distribution hitches and anti-sway bars needed to properly – and safely – handle heavy loads.

Take for example, Ram’s latest claim that its 3500-series truck can pull 31,210 pounds. You’ll need to look at the fine print to see that tow rating is only for a bed-mounted fifth-wheel or gooseneck hitch and requires the dual-rear-wheel package, a 4.10 axle ratio, and the high-output version of the Cummins inline-six turbodiesel mated to the Aisin automatic transmission. Picky picky

But that’s only the beginning. There’s a heap of other things to consider before dropping a trailer onto your truck’s ball or loading cargo into its bed."

I hope this helps you make the right decision for your needs. PLEASE don't take the opinion of people on the internet as gospel. There is a lot of misinformation floating around that could cause you great harm or cost you a great deal of money to correct after the fact. Do your homework and make sure your truck has the equipment necessary to pull the size trailer you intend to buy including all the extra stuff you intend to carry with you. Good luck!

 

[Al_Bear]

Hi Baare,
It looks like you would be at 99% of GCWR, or 96% if you don't bring your own water. If you decided to add even a little more gear, you would be over, for example, a screen house or bicycles. I don't totally agree with the 80% rule, but 99% seems too close to the max in any case.

As an alternative, you might consider a 21' fiberglass trailer, such as an Escape 21. Less roomy feeling inside, but lots lighter and more aerodynamic.

Here are some comments on your excellent spreadsheet, by cell. Some of this comments would be relevant not matter what you decide to do.

A14: Tongue weights on TT's often exceed 10%. Depends on where the fresh water tank is and where you place stuff that's heavy. A better guess would be 12%, of total trailer weight.

A19 to A24: You even consider the axle weight limits. Bravo! Not even close to being a problem, but it's good to be sure.

D30: You would be double-dipping if you added tongue weight here. Since you are comparing to GCWR, it does not matter where tongue weight gets included. In your approach, it's included in UVR + Trailer actual payload (A31+A32). Sometimes people will weigh a TT that is hitched to a TV with only the TT axles on the scales, thereby excluding tongue weight. Maybe that's why they needed to add it back in when they did the video that you saw.

N30 and N32: Curt makes a WDH with a built-in anti-sway feature. It uses a cam and ball bearing rather than friction. You don't need to detach it to back up, and it doesn't overheat on twisty roads because it does not work by friction. I think it's called the TruTrack series.

N33 and N36: If your WDH is adjusted properly, there will be some rear-end sag, but not too much. You should not need air bags or similar. Sag is not bad in itself, as long as the TT ends up pretty much level. Air bags do change the distribution of weight but only by a little.

N35: Modern SUV's and trucks already come with trans fluid cooling. That's already taken into account in the GCWR.

 

[baare657]

baare657,
I suggest you go here and read this very informative article about towing trailers. Click here: Towing, Payload, & GCVWR: What's It All Mean? | Top Speed

Here is a quote from the article:
"The first thing to understand is truckmakers publish the absolute maximum a truck can pull when its equipped just so with the correct powertrain options, suspension setups, and towing packages. Drop by a local dealership and pick a random truck off the lot and it’s highly likely it won’t be equipped to handle the advertised trailer weight.

What’s more, even with a truck that’s actually equipped with all the right gear for maximum towing, there are still aftermarket parts like weight-distribution hitches and anti-sway bars needed to properly – and safely – handle heavy loads.

Take for example, Ram’s latest claim that its 3500-series truck can pull 31,210 pounds. You’ll need to look at the fine print to see that tow rating is only for a bed-mounted fifth-wheel or gooseneck hitch and requires the dual-rear-wheel package, a 4.10 axle ratio, and the high-output version of the Cummins inline-six turbodiesel mated to the Aisin automatic transmission. Picky picky

But that’s only the beginning. There’s a heap of other things to consider before dropping a trailer onto your truck’s ball or loading cargo into its bed."

I hope this helps you make the right decision for your needs. PLEASE don't take the opinion of people on the internet as gospel. There is a lot of misinformation floating around that could cause you great harm or cost you a great deal of money to correct after the fact. Do your homework and make sure your truck has the equipment necessary to pull the size trailer you intend to buy including all the extra stuff you intend to carry with you. Good luck!

EZ,
In my limited experience, and watching those far wiser then I'll ever be, I've learned never to take any advice (free or paid), "expert analysis" or friendly suggestions as Ex cathedra. Ultimately, I'm responsible for the safety and well being of my family, and so I verify and bumble through any specs or claims with that in mind. Thanks for reinforcing that with your.... well, something similar to empathy, but in relation to safety and well being. Once I pick some contenders I'll update the spreadsheet and add to the thread, all you smarter fellas can comment and newer folks can learn from my mistakes.

 

[baare657]

Hi Baare,
It looks like you would be at 99% of GCWR, or 96% if you don't bring your own water. If you decided to add even a little more gear, you would be over, for example, a screen house or bicycles. I don't totally agree with the 80% rule, but 99% seems too close to the max in any case.

As an alternative, you might consider a 21' fiberglass trailer, such as an Escape 21. Less roomy feeling inside, but lots lighter and more aerodynamic.

Here are some comments on your excellent spreadsheet, by cell. Some of this comments would be relevant not matter what you decide to do.

A14: Tongue weights on TT's often exceed 10%. Depends on where the fresh water tank is and where you place stuff that's heavy. A better guess would be 12%, of total trailer weight.

A19 to A24: You even consider the axle weight limits. Bravo! Not even close to being a problem, but it's good to be sure.

D30: You would be double-dipping if you added tongue weight here. Since you are comparing to GCWR, it does not matter where tongue weight gets included. In your approach, it's included in UVR + Trailer actual payload (A31+A32). Sometimes people will weigh a TT that is hitched to a TV with only the TT axles on the scales, thereby excluding tongue weight. Maybe that's why they needed to add it back in when they did the video that you saw.

N30 and N32: Curt makes a WDH with a built-in anti-sway feature. It uses a cam and ball bearing rather than friction. You don't need to detach it to back up, and it doesn't overheat on twisty roads because it does not work by friction. I think it's called the TruTrack series.

N33 and N36: If your WDH is adjusted properly, there will be some rear-end sag, but not too much. You should not need air bags or similar. Sag is not bad in itself, as long as the TT ends up pretty much level. Air bags do change the distribution of weight but only by a little.

N35: Modern SUV's and trucks already come with trans fluid cooling. That's already taken into account in the GCWR.

AI_Bear,
Roger, updating the spreadsheet now. I agree and don't intend to choose anything close to the max limits of my equipment.

I'll bring the fiberglass trailers to the wife's attention. My guess is she will want a bunkhouse for the kids to sleep in. I'll discuss it with her and come up with my minimum specs. If we need a new vehicle, we'll just budget it and hold off on the experience for a while longer.

Updating my minimum equipment for the purposes of towing:

• Brake controller
• WDH
• anti-sway bars (i'll check the Curt you suggested)
• Mirrors for trailering
• rear camera (?)

I don't plan to purchase any time soon, but I think the plan will be:

1. find something that meets the towing specification + a decent margin
2. Load to, what I believe to be, maximum we would need on a trip and weigh on scale (Family, clothes, food, everything)
3. Practice and experiment with the handling on the local roads here in NC (we have some fair hills and highways)

As far as the camper experience, it's not something I don't have any experience with. Where I grew up, we would walk outside and say "lets set up camp on that mountain", gear up and hike there. I'm certain my kids will love it, but will need to see how the family works as a group. I wonder if this is an opportunity to RENT and try it out first to get a family consensus. I'll search through the threads here and start a discussion on the topic if I cannot find anything.

If I run into you folks out and about in the future, I'll get you a drink or a cigar (or pack your pipe for you, whichever you prefer).
Good discussion so far, thank you so much for your time,
-Matt

 

["EZ"]

EZ,
In my limited experience, and watching those far wiser then I'll ever be, I've learned never to take any advice (free or paid), "expert analysis" or friendly suggestions as Ex cathedra. Ultimately, I'm responsible for the safety and well being of my family, and so I verify and bumble through any specs or claims with that in mind. Thanks for reinforcing that with your.... well, something similar to empathy, but in relation to safety and well being. Once I pick some contenders I'll update the spreadsheet and add to the thread, all you smarter fellas can comment and newer folks can learn from my mistakes.

My biggest point I guess was that you really have to do your own research, like you said. Unfortunately you have to buy trucks to tow your RV from a CAR dealership. Most of the CAR salesmen don't know what they are talking about when it comes to the larger 2500/3500/4500/5500 trucks because they haven't been trained BUT they are allowed to sell them.

I was a Commercial Truck Manager at a dealership in Chattanooga and saw it first hand. The CAR Sales Managers didn't get paid on what I sold but they got paid on everything the CAR salesmen sold. So, when YOU would wander in to buy a new Ram 3500 diesel to pull your new 41' 5th wheel RV do you think they came to get the Commercial Truck Manager that had actually been trained and had spend 25 years selling trucks to help the TRUCK customer??? Heck no!! The Car Sales Manager wanted to get paid so he sent one of his CAR salesmen out to greet you and fake his way through all your questions pertaining to towing.

This same CAR Sales Manager is also the one ORDERING the trucks at most delaerships. He doesn't understand everything he needs to know to order the right packages to get the max towing that Ram is claiming on TV. That's why the article I referenced said that if you just pick any random truck on the lot chances are it isn't spec'd properly for the ratings on the door for towing. It's the same at Ford and Chevy too so don't think it's only the Ram dealers. If you add to this the well intentioned "advice" from the internet you really do have to be careful or you'll spend a lot of hard earned money on a truck that won't do the job or will barely do the job but be unsafe doing it.

Arm yourself with data from the MANUFACTURER. Ram has a great tool where you can build the right truck for your application. You can then print out the spec's and take them to the dealer to compare to what he has on the lot or to use to order what you want. I highly recommend using this tool so you can bypass all the CAR Salesmen BS at the dealership. Check it out here.......Build & Price Your New Ram Vehicle | Ram (ramtrucks.com)

Let me know if I can help. I actually left the CAR dealershipforthe reasons I stated above (and others) and went to work for a Ram Commercial Truck bailment pool and body company in Atlanta. I sell the commercial trucks TO THE RAM DEALERSHIPS all over the Southeast now. I spec the trucks out properly for the application and provide the bodies for the larger chassis up to 5500. I order the trucks so they don't have to. This way they are spec'd properly whether it's a dump truck or a service body truck. A large portion of what we sell are trucks for gooseneck and 5th wheel towing. Unfortunately it's not the pickup trucks that most RV owners need for towing their RV's. Those are still ordered by the Car Sales Manager who knows very little about truck towing. He's more concerned about making sure it has the 12" screened radio and the heated seats. lol.

 

[baare657]

EZ,
That is some really good experience and wisdom.
My wife and I came up with what we believe to be our minimum specifications and have been visiting RV dealerships and eyeballing some trailers that measure under 4K pounds onsite. We came up with a plan for the next 5-10 years, all subject to market forces, health etc.

Its pretty amazing. As all of you have stated, they tried to upscale my towing capacity, stating i should be looking at dry weights between 4500 to 5500 lbs. One swore up and down (unprompted) that he used to spec commercial vehicles for towing, and swore on his brontosaurus ancestry that i could tow more then the manufacturer's specifications.
We were polite and declined all offers and viewed RV's we had hand picked before arriving.

Reading the experiences on these threads make 5th wheel camping very appealing. We'll be budgeting for a F250 (minimum) to replace my 99 F150 that i love so much and is so beautiful in its own way. If there is a better reason to go with Chevy, dodge, whatever, let me know if i need to start another thread or search through the available forums.

Walk, crawl, run:
1. rent a couple times, small bunk houses, in some local parks.
2. Start with a small Bunkhouse, keeping trips within 300 miles, and no plans for the mountains.
3. Larger truck, start venturing into the mountains of NC and WV
4. 5th wheel, maybe

I'm glad I sourced the forum for information. It seems the RVing community is very strong and close knit.

 

[TJ&LadyDi]

Its pretty amazing. As all of you have stated, they tried to upscale my towing capacity, stating i should be looking at dry weights between 4500 to 5500 lbs. One swore up and down (unprompted) that he used to spec commercial vehicles for towing, and swore on his brontosaurus ancestry that i could tow more then the manufacturer's specifications.
We were polite and declined all offers and viewed RV's we had hand picked before arriving.

With your savvy approach, you will do fine! Do your homework, use common sense and don't let a salesman make a sale by glossing over the inconvenient facts.

TJ

 

[Lunge motorsport]

So...I am relatively new to this site but like what I am seeing here. I don't need to add anything to the knowledge posted here as it was well covered by several members. The reason for my comment now is that I want to remark that I appreciate the sharing of opinions and the intent to educate that is pervasive on this forum. Disagreement is beneficial but truth in numbers is undeniable. I am a member of several forums, all having something to do with RV's and tow vehicles. Many of the forums have their "Good Old Boys Club" that are legends in their own minds. I have had several disagreements with the members of other forums as they attempt to sway opinion based on opinions and false understandings. Some even have the title "The Man" in their signature to symbolize their perceived authoritarian view point. This particular individual cites NHTSA improperly to aid his argument and influence the members.
I am a builder of things, particularly automotive related. I appreciate someone who will take a product and as an end user, modify it to increase it's safety and comfort. I spend a lot of time and money on my projects to achieve those results. As an example, I own a 5th wheel that no longer has 4400# leaf spring axles and dumb brakes, but now has 7000# torsion axles and huge hydraulic vented disc brakes with large 4 piston calipers. According to "The Man", I am in violation of several written Gov. mandates that require certifications. Aaarrrgggghhhhh!
My advice here...Buy bigger, longer, and heavier tow vehicle than you believe will accommodate the specific trailer you are currently considering. You will most likely upgrade to a larger RV in the future. Do not consider a 3/4 ton vehicle if you want a diesel power plant, you will run out of payload long before you run out of max trailer towing ability.
Finally, good on ya EZ for bringing it home...
Cheers

 

["EZ"]

Finally, good on ya EZ for bringing it home...
Cheers

Just trying to help educate people that don't understand what they need to be able to tow what they want as a camper. Let me know if you have any technical questions. If I don't know the answer I'll look them up in one of my resource books. I have a lot of data at my disposal. Sure was glad to hear that you put bigger brakes on your camper and not just bigger axles and heavier suspension. Some of these people on RV forums scare me at their lack of knowledge and their unwillingness to listen to reason. I realize that buying the CORRECT truck is not the cheapest way out but you're going to have your FAMILY in there. It's obvious that money is more important than their kids well being. There are actually some of these idiots that BRAG about how small their truck is compared to how large their camper is!!! And of course they always say that their S-10 tows their 45' Grand Design just fine!!