Nitrogen in tires

[MemoriesByTheMile]

Adverse - only having to add air more often and what I see as accelerated wear due to not always keeping pressures optimal. Resulting in replacing tires sooner.

 

[Crazydog]

That makes no sense. If your tires were going to leak they would leak regardless of whether they were filled with plain old air or Nitrogen.
Do you adjust your air pressure according to what elevation you're at?

 

[MemoriesByTheMile]

Studies have shown that normal air in a tire will escape a slightly faster rate than a 95% nitrogen fill - at passenger vehicle tire pressure.
In higher pressure scenarios, such as big rig tires, the difference is a more pronounced as the air loss %, based on a higher pressure, will be a larger psi difference.
Of course - if every driver checked and adjusted tire pressure every month then the difference between nitrogen and standard air will not be noticeable. But since most people don’t test/check tire pressures the nitrogen will maintain the tire pressure longer than standard air.
There is also the factor of the dryness of the air and lack of oxygen in the nitrogen fill, which can slightly slow down the tire degradation on the interior (of course the exterior is still exposed to standard air, but at normal atmospheric pressures).
Nitrogen does provide for a little more pressure stability - this can also mean a little less “hassle” of adding air as frequently. But on the nitrogen side there is more hassle of adding nitrogen when you do need it.
Nitrogen does make a difference. The question comes down to whether each of us finds enough value in it that we want to use it.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

That's crazy dog!!!

Nitrogen is right next to oxygen on the periodic table,so no large difference between the two. However nitrogen is to the Left of oxygen making oxygen a larger element.

It is this difference in size that allows separating the two in typical machinery designed to do so!!!

As I said previously the membrane builtin to a tubeless tire will oxidize and allow the pressure to pass with time as it degrades. nitrogen will not oxidize that membrane, so no change will take place.

Because oxygen is smaller than nitrogen there is less likely hood the tire will loose pressure, when filled with nitrogen.

Adding to this, when the membrane is degraded enough, tire separation issues increase.

I don't expect the average person to actually know why they do what they do, but most do what's easy, and less expensive, some know the science behind what they do!!!

 

[Crazydog]

If this alleged "degradation" on the inside of the tires made any noticeable difference in the life of the tire it might be worth the hassle and expense of using N.
Like perhaps a lifespan of 2 years as opposed 5 years. Any actual difference in tire life would be so small that it would be unmeasurable.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

If this alleged "degradation" on the inside of the tires made any noticeable difference in the life of the tire it might be worth the hassle and expense of using N.
Like perhaps a lifespan of 2 years as opposed 5 years.

You now know the science!

It will remain your option what you do with it.

 

[Buc]

Picking and choosing which science to believe in is the American way!

 

[Crazydog]

Can you show us the difference in tire life? Do you have any actual data to support the "longer life" claim?

 

[team bradfield]

Can you show us the difference in tire life? Do you have any actual data to support the "longer life" claim?

I'd like to see the data also, I personally think its hogwash, been using plain old air for over 25 years in my trailers, only 2 flats, my own fault, overloaded trailers in my younger days...

 

[Buc]

Can you show us the difference in tire life? Do you have any actual data to support the "longer life" claim?

I’ll hazard a guess that if you drive your more than once in a blue moon, you’re going to wear out the tire faster than they’ll degrade.

nd if the tires aren’t used enough, they’re going to degrade just as fast from the outside. Unless of course you pay some service to replace the air in your storage shed with nitrogen.

 

[Buc]

“Bottom line: Nitrogen will slow the amount of tire inflation loss to about one-third of what you’ll experience with air. This means instead of losing one to two PSI per month, you’ll lose ⅓ to ⅔ PSI per month. You’ll still need to check and top off your air roughly every other month to stay within the ideal inflation range. And you’ll spend far more than you’ll save on gas and tire tread life. You’re better off making simple tire maintenance part of your routine.”

Are Nitrogen-Filled Tires Worth the Cost? - Les Schwab.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

For myself,this will be my last comment on this topic!
I can find both pro and con on using nitrogen. I know! I just spent intimate time with duck duck go! National testing laboratories documents are harder to find, but they are my preference on such topics.

Anyhow, will a tire last longer using nitrogen in the tires, and will it have a significant impact on your wallet???

In your daily driver, not likely!

On your bus? I don't know, seems that rubber in commercial applications is very low cost! I don't know, but very few that I know of get close to full milage from a set on the old RV!

So you don't wear them out in most cases!

This is what I have seen here. One tire for your bus is what I pay for a set on the trailer,or the truck. I wear out the truck tires long before the 6 year limit, so nitrogen is not All that important.

On the trailers age is the issue in most years, so I can benefit. However when a set can be had for less than one commercial tire! Well!!!

If you break it down to monthly outlay, you might be surprised!

Why?

Carcass life defined by the manufacturers are based on Air filled tires. Even though they warranty the carcass for 7 in most cases,the real safe life is closer to 5, or 6 years. So monthly cost difference between say 5 and 7 becomes quite significant.

I am sure a few here can talk about bubbles or separation, (but I don't want to fear monger here), leading to tire change in earlier than they would like! Others stretch that time closer to 6 or 7! One extra safe year on the scale.is nothing to sneeze at.

Understand that deterioration from the inside increases tire separation. Tire separation leads to blow outs, and blow outs lead to serious damage,or loss of life!!!

To close I will leave a reference:

Why Should I Fill My Tires With Nitrogen? | Drive Home Safe

Think I need a little time off!!!!

 

[Crazydog]

Thank you Mr. Penn. So what you said is there is no meaningful difference in the life of a tire filled with N as opposed to a tire filled with plain old 78% N from the air all around us.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

Thank you Mr. Penn. So what you said is there is no meaningful difference in the life of a tire filled with N as opposed to a tire filled with plain old 78% N from the air all around us.

Let me start with pem is My pen name,but your close!

And if 1 to 2 years on a thousand dollar investment is meaningless! Then maybe you are correct in your interpretation of my Post!!

Let me be more clear for you!!!

1000/60=14 or 168 per tire (rounded down) for each tire to stretch one more year out of it!
No tag 6 times 168 is 1008 for not using nitrogen 1344 with a tag.

I know most users of this site are savvy enough in economics to understand what I was saying!!! And by admission some people who have had blow outs, have stretched the Big Five! There is no guarantee a tire defect was not the reason, however nitrogen would have reduced the likelihood of tire separation!


One or two years is in fact meaningless to me as I have no reason to push replacement dates out, no tire is cheap, but I it was going to cost me 4grand to replace rubber on my truck then I might push the envelope from 5 to 6! But I like my old trailer,and truck to much to risk an early demise!!!

Hope that put more clarity to my post!!

Kevin D PEM

 

[redbaron]

As many of you know, I have a few really nice sports cars. I have had BMW's for 20+ years, and until this year the BMW dealer always used Nitrogen. When I purchased my latest M3 it came from the dealer with Nitrogen. Earlier this year I purchased a new Cadillac CT5V Blackwing, and it did not have nitrogen. I was a little disappointed, as I had always had nitrogen in my sports cars. I assumed that the crazy American's just where not as advanced as the Germans, so I took my Blackwing to the BMW dealer and asked for Nitrogen.

My rep was more than happy to fill it with nitrogen, and didn't even charge me, but while doing so he said that BMW USA has dropped the nitrogen requirement for all cars, including the M, as their data has shown no benefit from running nitrogen.

I personally see the benefit of not having to add or reduce air as the seasons change, but the automotive industry is moving away from it. I am not sure how Porsche is going to change, but my guess is they will continue to fill for a while as they began the trend for the sports cars.

I decided that it wasn't worth getting nitrogen tanks at the house, so I am now going back to 78% nitrogen for all my tires when they need it.