Resolved Broken down in Breckenridge....

[FLSteve]

First glad @Neal your on the move again.

I have a Spartan and was told that you can’t do a forced regen without specific equipment, ie computer/software.
I am arriving at Spartan in Charlotte, MI today and will discuss things more with them. I have a check engine light with key on which will go out after about 20-30 seconds. I have driven approximately 4000 miles this way as it is considered an inactive message from a previous incident and will be reset by Spartan.

Additional note, I run BlueFire which will clear some active faults but not inactive faults.

@NWIP ... please post what you learn up there for us other Spartan owners.

FLSteve

 

[GlampDaddy]

I am arriving at Spartan in Charlotte, MI today and will discuss things more with them.

Ships passing in the night. I'm warming the engine now, about to leave the Spartan CG.

 

[Rich W.]

First glad @Neal your on the move again.

I have a Spartan and was told that you can’t do a forced regen without specific equipment, ie computer/software.
I am arriving at Spartan in Charlotte, MI today and will discuss things more with them. I have a check engine light with key on which will go out after about 20-30 seconds. I have driven approximately 4000 miles this way as it is considered an inactive message from a previous incident and will be reset by Spartan.

Additional note, I run BlueFire which will clear some active faults but not inactive faults.

Have you tried turning your key on but not starting the engine and waiting for the check eng light to go out before starting the engine?

Also as Redbaron stated you can do parked regens with a variety of devices, some simple and very economical like the one he noted, and then increasing in cost and functionality on up to dealer level stuff. But its important to have some method of doing regens yourself, because as Neal has so aptly pointed out, the system will not take care of itself except under perfect conditions. And we don't operate out coaches under those.

 

[Rd1]

@Neal - "found a safe spot and immediately forced the regen which it worked as the RPM went up, and after 20 minutes it completed and all lights were out."

glad you worked it out. How did you force the regen?

@RB - walmart appears to have the same tool. it looks (?) to be the same exact model; $148.99

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[NWIP]

Have you tried turning your key on but not starting the engine and waiting for the check eng light to go out before starting the engine?

Also as Redbaron stated you can do parked regens with a variety of devices, some simple and very economical like the one he noted, and then increasing in cost and functionality on up to dealer level stuff. But its important to have some method of doing regens yourself, because as Neal has so aptly pointed out, the system will not take care of itself except under perfect conditions. And we don't operate out coaches under those.

Yes I never start engine until the check engine light goes out.

Here is the message which is inactive, it was caused by a active regen that was unable to complete because of extended road construction and low speed. I have since had probably 5-6 regen’s that completed normally. I agree that having a device that allows owners to do forced regen is very valuable to

 

[sheridany]

@Neal i had a situation a few years ago where I contacted coach net about an issue I was having with my Ventana and they sent a mobile tech out and I paid the bill with the understanding from the coach net rep on the phone they would reimburse me. I submitted the receipt and they denied the claim and said it wasn’t covered. I am curious to see if they reimburse you. Hopefully they will.

 

[ARD]

, it was caused by a active regen that was unable to complete because of extended road construction and low speed.

That happened to me right before the balloon fiesta when we all met in Santa Fe. I got codes that I needed a new DPF which was unlikely as my coach was only a few years old. I made it to Cummins. Soot got stuck and they did a forced regen and I was good to go. Definitely going to order @redbaron's suggested device. As far as I know, you do need a device to clear codes and force the regen. Will be interested in what you find out at Spartan.

 

[redbaron]

@RB - walmart appears to have the same tool. it looks (?) to be the same exact model; $148.99

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Yes...this is a good deal!

 

[Neal]

I did not go to TransWest as the panel was clear

I did a forced regen with toad attached, I had no choice but I'm not concerned. The heat is below the after treatment device (under engine compartment) and I don't consider the TOAD at risk.

I will make a suggestion in a few but I think somewhere on the panel we should be able to read a DPF filter level, it should show the customer without need for a technician and allow us to decide if we need to initiate a regen.

Thanks @redbaron I'll order that device and see what it shows before it sells out

 

[Neal]

How to do a forced regen is coach dependent. I have a series of steps which were posted above by @Rich W. but essentially start the engine, apply brake, disengage/re-engage parking brake, under ODB port is a white plug that has a red locking switch. I have to slide the red lock away, disconnect and reconnect the plug and then RPM will immediately rise to about 1000 and indicate it is doing a regen. No other indications or messages on mine (or I don't know where to look), wait until RPM drops. This is very specific to my coach and year.

Roger that @sheridany I'll see what they say. I'll pay a $300 bill any day and smile with joy to avoid a tow and tech decided actions that will run up the bill way more as we all know.

@ARD I do remember and the thing in common is high altitude. We were at Angel fire before that (around 9K elevation) and this just makes me thing for high altitude RVing we need to consider regen's - can't hurt. IF you can do them.

If I missed any questions please point out to me or ask again.

FYI - I immediately called the FL 24/7 number on Labor Day, they answered and guided me through the steps. Super nice, and very responsive.

 

[Neal]

Ouray was super kind by the way and releasing me from my fully paid reservation less 5% (credit card processing fees). I just need to provide them proof of my break down (repair bill). I'm sad I didn't make it to this location as it was one of the top stops I was looking for, will have to do it another day. Pagosa Springs was super accommodating and had space and let me arrive 5 days early before my 2 week schedule stay. Very friendly...

 

[ARD]

9K elevation) and this just makes me thing for high altitude RVing we need to consider regen's - can't hurt. IF you can do them.

I don't know. I'm typically always in high altitudes. I was in Glenwood Springs, Moab, Pagosa Springs prior to meeting up with you in Angel Fire. I was doing an active regen, but there was construction on the road and then we arrived in Santa Fe, so it never completed. I'm more inclined to believe that it was a result of the active regen not being able to finish. Big Mike at Spartan always said if your coach is doing an active regen and you are near your exit, pass it. Keep going until it finishes.

 

[FLSteve]

Big Mike at Spartan always said if your coach is doing an active regen and you are near your exit, pass it. Keep going until it finishes.

@ARD ... good to know. The only time mine has done one was on I-10 traveling east and it took about an hour. I was happy just to keep going until it finished. But I was wondering if you should shut off your engine when in a regen mode and arrive where you are going. You have answered that question for me.

FLSteve

 

[Neal]

Big Mike at Spartan always said if your coach is doing an active regen and you are near your exit, pass it. Keep going until it finishes.

Do as you wish but I think the answer is don't turn your engine off. If you're in a regen situation it will manage the RPM as needed such as 1000 RPM was used for my forced regen. It also is telling you not to park over anything that could be a hazard such as leaves, grass OR go to a fuel stop. In some scenarios you can't just drive at will, maybe ask them for clarification, not sure that's great advice personally. Can you imagine that scenario in the Rockies?? Having learned how subtle a regen is (1000 RPM) and that can take an hour or more, my advice would be fine a place to park and don't turn the engine off, wait for the regen to complete, if you're stopping, otherwise keep the engine running is all that's necessary.

 

[Rich W.]

Do as you wish but I think the answer is don't turn your engine off. If you're in a regen situation it will manage the RPM as needed such as 1000 RPM was used for my forced regen. It also is telling you not to park over anything that could be a hazard such as leaves, grass OR go to a fuel stop. In some scenarios you can't just drive at will, maybe ask them for clarification, not sure that's great advice personally. Can you imagine that scenario in the Rockies??

It’s ok to interrupt a regen, just not advisable as a practice unless its necessary. If you do have to stop, it will try again as soon as conditions are right, but you can also just drive to an appropriate location and kill an hour doing a parked/manual/forced regen. Either way, if you get the warning ding and the DPF and/or the HEST lamp is on when you exit the freeway or slow for a small town or whatever, its telling you its regen time.

BUT, this is the first example (and now two of them because of this thread) that I’ve read about with so little warning before going into de-rate and “stop engine” status. You should, according to the literature, have several hours to get to a safe location for a regen. Something to look into further.
I guess given these experiences, everyone should be doing parked regens periodically as a maintenance/preemptive measure.

Its always good to refamiliarize yourself with the DPF and HEST lamps and what they mean when they start doing their thing. Note that #4 in the second image is for trucks with a switch on the dash, and for those with a FL chassis, you use the “shorting plug” proceedure described above by Neal and in the link I posted earlier. For Spartan, it appears you need an external device to initiate a parked/forced regen.

 

[Neal]

I never got a flashing light, only steady DPF lamp. And as you know soon thereafter red. I will be actively maintaining my DPF system going forward. I wonder if AGE of coach plays in. New coaches may take years to get to a DPF full / maintenance situation, it's now going on 5+ years for me. New coach owners may not need to worry. Put a few years and miles on (I have 53K) then things may change.

 

[Neal]

It’s ok to interrupt a regen, just not advisable as a practice unless its necessary

My tech interrupted mine when he thought it was complete and the DPF filter showed clean. As you know I drove off and immediately got the regen light again. This makes me hesitant in ever stopping one. I'd leave engine running until it shows complete.

 

[redbaron]

Well I did something Monday that I hope to never repeat, but does explain a bit about how the newer coaches behave.

The ISX gets an average of 110MPG on DEF fluid. Newmar advertises that the DEF tank is 15 gallons.

We had traveled 900 miles without adding DEF due to my desire to get rid of the old stuff that had been sitting for 70 days. I ran the math, and figured I had at least 500 miles to go, so we pushed on thru Yellowstone from the west, went east thru Cody and Lovell, and chose a route climbing out of Lovell WY to Sheridan. This is some serious mountain climbing, especially the route we took.

At 1100 miles, the Def gauge turned red. My wife was driving, and I told her casually that we should be good. I mentioned that if we see a easy place to pull off near a C-store, I would run in and buy some DEF.

Neither of us deemed it urgent, and we passed 4 of them and kept going.

at 1150 miles, we where on the highway and passed a big truck stop. It wasn't on the app and we where not prepared to stop in time, so we kept going..again under the assumption that we had 400 miles. I was targeting a stopy in Cheyenne where we would take on fuel. I figured 1500 miles should be easy to do on a full tank of DEF.

at 1160 miles, we received a yellow CEL. There is a code associated with it, but I wasn't driving and did not record it. I will pull it up later.

at 1180 miles, the dash display changed to a flashing red on the def gauge and a constant repeat of the Yellow CEL...this had me nervous for the first time, because now I am reading @Neal thread and starting to think I made a mistake.

We found a C-store @ 1205 miles and I added 5 gallons of DEF. We never shutdown the engine. The code cleared somewhere between the 2 jugs of DEF--not sure when.

We then drove for another 245 miles and stopped at a fuel truck stop with pump-def.
I added as much DEF as I could, and it took 10 gallons.

If my math was correct about the 100MPg average, then it should have taken 12-13 gallons.
While we know that DEF usage is not 1:1 per mile, meaning that it could drive 90 miles not using any, then use 1 gallon over the next 10 miles, I am also thinking that the reserve of the DEF tank is artificially lower than I assumed. I believe that the computer will start derate with over 1 gallon left in the tank, and by my math closer to 2 gallons.

So to be safe, assume 20% of the tank reserve is unusable - or 300 miles worth of DEF in the ISX-605HP

I usually refill between 1/8 and 1/4 tank of Diesel, and try to skip DEF between every other stop. I will have to start carrying a spare bottle to prevent a future scare.

 

[Texas Clodhopper]

I'm thankful you resolved your problem, but sorry you will miss Ouray. We've been here since Sunday and leave Sunday, so much to see and do here.
I believe you're planning on doing forced regenerations on a scheduled basis, but I also read you can't do a forced regen unless the DPF light is on. How do you plan on doing the forced regen?

 

[ARD]

not sure that's great advice personally. Can you imagine that scenario in the Rockies??

Obviously you cannot always keep going like what happened to me when I had to stop at a one lane closure in the mountains, but Big Mike is making the point - better to let an active regen do its job without interrupting it, if possible.

I’m always happy to see an active regen. The only time I ever had a problem was when an active regen was interrupted. I’m not sure forced regents are necessary as part of a maintenance program, but I’ll be asking Spartan when I get there next month.