Resolved Broken down in Breckenridge....

[Neal]

@redbaron - I'm not going to test it but I thought we could drive X miles when DEF is empty before derate, FL said 1000 miles I believe. But if you stop (engine off?) you go into derate. Again - I'm not validating this info.

@Texas Clodhopper - Yeah, very sad to not see Ouray, it was the highlight of this route. I looked at driving up from Pagosa Springs per recommendation of @ARD as an option but it's nearly 3 hours so not gonna be doing that. As to force regen with no light, we'll find out near the end of the month when I'm in a big city, or maybe near Gaffney as I'm headed and see what happens. Our coaches have the shorting plug so not sure how that plays in.

 

[Neal]

Obviously you cannot always keep going like what happened to me when I had to stop at a one lane closure in the mountains, but Big Mike is making the point - better to let an active regen do its job without interrupting it, if possible.

I’m always happy to see an active regen. The only time I ever had a problem was when an active regen was interrupted. I’m not sure forced regents are necessary as part of a maintenance program, but I’ll be asking Spartan when I get there next month.

My concern is my "auto regen" is not doing its job. We have no way to know if it did one, when was the last one, etc. at least without diagnostics. What if our auto regen "sensor/system" isn't working? That's what I don't know and need to ask. If we had an indication of DPF clogging (zones/phases) then we'd know we're good or not. I made the suggestion below, upvote (arrows on right) if you want this too:

Work with Freightliner and Spartan to show DPF filter clog level

To allow owners to avoid DPF filter stop engine situations and know when to initiate regens if needed, please work with your chassis vendors and Cummins to have the DPF filter level (phase or percent) shown on the menu. And/or show an amber warning with a number if it reaches a level where the...

rvforums.com

 

[Rich W.]

I never got a flashing light, only steady DPF lamp. And as you know soon thereafter red. I will be actively maintaining my DPF system going forward. I wonder if AGE of coach plays in. New coaches may take years to get to a DPF full / maintenance situation, it's now going on 5+ years for me. New coach owners may not need to worry. Put a few years and miles on (I have 53K) then things may change.

http://www.ourmotorhome.net/2017/docs/DPF_Regen_instructions.pdf

Given the discussion in the above link, it looks like you went straight from DPF lamp on (page 100), to all stop - yer screwed (page 103) with out the benefit of the published 2-6 hours grace period. I guess sometimes the coach don’t read the book.

 

[Neal]

That light should look like this:

 

[J&JD]

I never got a flashing light, only steady DPF lamp. And as you know soon thereafter red. I will be actively maintaining my DPF system going forward. I wonder if AGE of coach plays in. New coaches may take years to get to a DPF full / maintenance situation, it's now going on 5+ years for me. New coach owners may not need to worry. Put a few years and miles on (I have 53K) then things may change.

I have almost exactly the same mileage on our 2017 and have never ever had a regen light come on. Is this normal? Would there ever be a reason for me to do a forced regen if I never get a dash light warning?

 

[Neal]

I have almost exactly the same mileage on our 2017 and have never ever had a regen light come on. Is this normal? Would there ever be a reason for me to do a forced regen if I never get a dash light warning?

Neither have I. I did in the first 10K miles or so then never saw it again.

 

[Rich W.]

I'm thankful you resolved your problem, but sorry you will miss Ouray. We've been here since Sunday and leave Sunday, so much to see and do here.
I believe you're planning on doing forced regenerations on a scheduled basis, but I also read you can't do a forced regen unless the DPF light is on. How do you plan on doing the forced regen?

You need some type of device to perform a parked regen without the DPF light on. This was a surprise to me re-reading the “shorting plug” instructions, but its good to have a code reader capable of doing regens and clearing codes anyway.

I’ve never used the plug, but I’ve done numerous parked regens with OTR as a maintenance practice (it shows DPF % full in the live data) and will report back when I get my new Diesel Laptops Handheld unit in a few days. I bought this: Used Diesel Laptops Handheld Heavy-Duty Scan Tool with Regen as they have some used for $299.

They have a 30 day return policy so if I dont like it I’ll send it back, but I want something that will work indpendent of the OTR app and internet access. OTR says that with the release of the new version, it will function without the internet, but I haven't tried that yet. I’ll test that when I test the Diesel Laptops handheld unit.

 

[Texas Clodhopper]

You need some type of device to perform a parked regen without the DPF light on. This was a surprise to me re-reading the “shorting plug” instructions, but its good to have a code reader capable of doing regens and clearing codes anyway.

I’ve never used the plug, but I’ve done numerous parked regens with OTR as a maintenance practice (it shows DPF % full in the live data) and will report back when I get my new Diesel Laptops Handheld unit in a few days. I bought this: Used Diesel Laptops Handheld Heavy-Duty Scan Tool with Regen as they have some used for $299.

They have a 30 day return policy so if I dont like it I’ll send it back, but I want something that will work indpendent of the OTR app and internet access. OTR says that with the release of the new version, it will function without the internet, but I haven't tried that yet. I’ll test that when I test the Diesel Laptops handheld unit.

I bought the one Red Baron recommended earlier.

 

[Rich W.]

I have almost exactly the same mileage on our 2017 and have never ever had a regen light come on. Is this normal? Would there ever be a reason for me to do a forced regen if I never get a dash light warning?

This is one of many blogs on the subject from the OTR website:
“If the soot level is low, can I still perform a forced DPF regen with OTR Diagnostics or the OTR Reset Tool?

Yes, OTR Diagnostics the OTR Reset Tool will allow you to start a forced DPF regen no matter what the soot level is.
In order for any diagnostic tool to start a forced DPF regen it must first start a diagnostic session to be able to communicate to the engine and aftertreatment controllers. Once the connection is established it then sends the commands to start a forced DPF regen.
Is your parked regen light flashing? Click here to go to our blog post addressing this issue.
Why would I run a forced DPF regen if my truck is not asking for one?

Running a forced regen decreases soot level and provides for a less restricted and more free-flowing exhaust system. With less restricted exhaust flow you can expect to see better efficiency when it comes to fuel economy and DEF consumption, saving you money.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the gauge on the dash is a calculation and can sometimes be inaccurate. By doing the forced DPF regen you are lowering the soot level and keeping your system running at peak performance.
To run or to not run a forced DPF regen:
You need to monitor a few parameters to assess whether or not it is necessary to run a forced DPF regen.
You need to monitor your

• Fuel mileage
• DEF consumption
• Exhaust gas temperature
• Boost pressure
• Fault Codes
  • You may also have an aftertreatment fault code that is triggered when it’s necessary to run a forced DPF regen.

Our recommendations on how often you should run a forced DPF regen:

1. Perform a forced DPF regen every 2-3 weeks if you are
   • OTR Driving - carrying light loads
   • City Driving
   • Not reaching highway speeds with your vehicle
2. Perform a forced DPF regen once a month if you are
   • OTR Driving – carrying heavy loads
   • Operate Off-Highway equipment”

For more reading on the subject go here:

Search: 11 results found for "parked regen"

OTR Performance® | Advanced diagnostic tools for various industries including these engines: Cummins, Detroit Diesel, Paccar, Volvo, Mack and more. We help your business operations grow with reliable product, exceptional service and guaranteed support. Join the OTR Community today.

otrperformance.com

Yes this includes OTR advertising their product but its good info. Keep in mind that their target market is truck drivers who naturally operate their vehicles differently.

You don’t necessarily need live data and all the libraries and other functions of more expensive monitoring devices but you should have some means of performing forced regens and do so periodically based on your driving.

 

[J&JD]

This tool will do a forced regen on either chassis as well as read and reset most codes. It's not a replacement for OTR, but cheap enough that every coach owner should have it and know how to use it. Ebay sells it for under $140.00.

Amazon has it for under $200

You must get the plus version for forced regen and other emissions reset.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0739WS69C/?tag=rvf01-20

This tool sure has a lot of people saying it doesn’t work. @redbaron, have you had personal success using it?

 

[jagpot]

This tool will do a forced regen on either chassis as well as read and reset most codes. It's not a replacement for OTR, but cheap enough that every coach owner should have it and know how to use it. Ebay sells it for under $140.00.

Amazon has it for under $200

You must get the plus version for forced regen and other emissions reset.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0739WS69C/?tag=rvf01-20

I have never done a forced regen but Newmar did last year on the maintenance. Would not have the foggiest idea how to. I have a Spartan (King Aire) 2014. Suggestions on where to go to learn?

 

[jagpot]

Back in March a few hours after leaving the Mothership I stopped to fuel up. When I started up again I got a DPF error Source 0, SPN 3720 FMI 15 but when I started driving it went away. I figured it was from all the start and stopping going into the service bays and after a few regens it would go away, My 2018 DSDP on Spartan does regens all the time, Spartan said it was nothing to worry about. In May I was at NIRVC in Atlanta and had them look at it. They said they couldn't reproduce it but it happens almost every time you start the engine and goes away when you move or give it some RPMs. They also said they couldn't do anything because their autoclave machine was down. You would have thought they would have cleared the codes but they didn't and they were short staffed and wanted me out of there. I probably would have had to spend another day there just for that. So that was 6 months ago and about 6,000+ miles.

I have a 2014 Spartan. When you say yours does it all the time does it do it automatically? I am really confused on this issue. Thinking of getting a Nexlink scanner that the Red Baron suggested but don't know if that will work.

 

[redbaron]

View attachment 14364This tool sure has a lot of people saying it doesn’t work. @redbaron, have you had personal success using it?

No...but I will tomorrow. Amazon has flexible return so if you guys want to wait until I have tested I will report back.
Update:
I spoke with the MFG and they did assure me it was compatible with 2022 cummins ISX-15, so that is the best info I have for now.

 

[Magua]

I have a 2014 Spartan. When you say yours does it all the time does it do it automatically? I am really confused on this issue. Thinking of getting a Nexlink scanner that the Red Baron suggested but don't know if that will work.

X2

 

[FLSteve]

No...but I will tomorrow. Amazon has flexible return so if you guys want to wait until I have tested I will report back.
Update:
I spoke with the MFG and they did assure me it was compatible with 2022 cummins ISX-15, so that is the best info I have for now.

Thanks @redbaron ... I will put my order on hold until you do some testing and report back.

FLSteve

 

[J&JD]

ve never used the plug, but I’ve done numerous parked regens with OTR as a maintenance practice (it shows DPF % full in the live data) and will report back when I get my new Diesel Laptops Handheld unit in a few days. I bought this: Used Diesel Laptops Handheld Heavy-Duty Scan Tool with Regen as they have some used for $299.

They have a 30 day return policy so if I dont like it I’ll send it back, but I want something that will work indpendent of the OTR app and internet access. OTR says that with the release of the new version, it will function without the internet, but I haven't tried that yet. I’ll test that when I test the Diesel Laptops handheld unit.

Just curious why you would need the Diesel handheld if you have the OTR and they will soon have the no internet upgrade?

 

[Rich W.]

Just curious why you would need the Diesel handheld if you have the OTR and they will soon have the no internet upgrade?

I just want back up and independent sources. I like to be able to compare results. I talked to OTR today and they said the app can be used without the internet for 14 days. Then you have to log on again and the clock starts over. Their way of making sure you keep your subscription current while allowing you to use their product when not in range of any service.

 

[FloridaSon]

Yes I never start engine until the check engine light goes out.

Here is the message which is inactive, it was caused by a active regen that was unable to complete because of extended road construction and low speed. I have since had probably 5-6 regen’s that completed normally. I agree that having a device that allows owners to do forced regen is very valuable

I have a 2022 FL chassis and the lagging yellow check engine light that lights with key on and stays on 20-30 seconds is the last dash light to go out.

Asked at my dealership and they just thought it was a harmless variable. I said even if it never did that before?

Knowing your system is a good idea, you are right. Sounds like that kind of CEL issue needs to be cleared by FL in my case. Thanks for the insight.

Sometimes this lifestyle is like the game of CLUE. Regards

 

[Neal]

I asked Cummins about that light and it's normal. Comes on because no oil pressure yet.

 

[Buly]

Well I did something Monday that I hope to never repeat, but does explain a bit about how the newer coaches behave.

The ISX gets an average of 110MPG on DEF fluid. Newmar advertises that the DEF tank is 15 gallons.

We had traveled 900 miles without adding DEF due to my desire to get rid of the old stuff that had been sitting for 70 days. I ran the math, and figured I had at least 500 miles to go, so we pushed on thru Yellowstone from the west, went east thru Cody and Lovell, and chose a route climbing out of Lovell WY to Sheridan. This is some serious mountain climbing, especially the route we took.

At 1100 miles, the Def gauge turned red. My wife was driving, and I told her casually that we should be good. I mentioned that if we see a easy place to pull off near a C-store, I would run in and buy some DEF.

Neither of us deemed it urgent, and we passed 4 of them and kept going.

at 1150 miles, we where on the highway and passed a big truck stop. It wasn't on the app and we where not prepared to stop in time, so we kept going..again under the assumption that we had 400 miles. I was targeting a stopy in Cheyenne where we would take on fuel. I figured 1500 miles should be easy to do on a full tank of DEF.

at 1160 miles, we received a yellow CEL. There is a code associated with it, but I wasn't driving and did not record it. I will pull it up later.

at 1180 miles, the dash display changed to a flashing red on the def gauge and a constant repeat of the Yellow CEL...this had me nervous for the first time, because now I am reading @Neal thread and starting to think I made a mistake.

We found a C-store @ 1205 miles and I added 5 gallons of DEF. We never shutdown the engine. The code cleared somewhere between the 2 jugs of DEF--not sure when.

We then drove for another 245 miles and stopped at a fuel truck stop with pump-def.
I added as much DEF as I could, and it took 10 gallons.

If my math was correct about the 100MPg average, then it should have taken 12-13 gallons.
While we know that DEF usage is not 1:1 per mile, meaning that it could drive 90 miles not using any, then use 1 gallon over the next 10 miles, I am also thinking that the reserve of the DEF tank is artificially lower than I assumed. I believe that the computer will start derate with over 1 gallon left in the tank, and by my math closer to 2 gallons.

So to be safe, assume 20% of the tank reserve is unusable - or 300 miles worth of DEF in the ISX-605HP

I usually refill between 1/8 and 1/4 tank of Diesel, and try to skip DEF between every other stop. I will have to start carrying a spare bottle to prevent a future scare.

I always told myself: Assumption is the Mother of ALL f—- up’s.