Nitrogen in tires

[Fueco]

“Bottom line: Nitrogen will slow the amount of tire inflation loss to about one-third of what you’ll experience with air. This means instead of losing one to two PSI per month, you’ll lose ⅓ to ⅔ PSI per month. You’ll still need to check and top off your air roughly every other month to stay within the ideal inflation range. And you’ll spend far more than you’ll save on gas and tire tread life. You’re better off making simple tire maintenance part of your routine.”

Are Nitrogen-Filled Tires Worth the Cost? - Les Schwab.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

For myself,this will be my last comment on this topic!
I can find both pro and con on using nitrogen. I know! I just spent intimate time with duck duck go! National testing laboratories documents are harder to find, but they are my preference on such topics.

Anyhow, will a tire last longer using nitrogen in the tires, and will it have a significant impact on your wallet???

In your daily driver, not likely!

On your bus? I don't know, seems that rubber in commercial applications is very low cost! I don't know, but very few that I know of get close to full milage from a set on the old RV!

So you don't wear them out in most cases!

This is what I have seen here. One tire for your bus is what I pay for a set on the trailer,or the truck. I wear out the truck tires long before the 6 year limit, so nitrogen is not All that important.

On the trailers age is the issue in most years, so I can benefit. However when a set can be had for less than one commercial tire! Well!!!

If you break it down to monthly outlay, you might be surprised!

Why?

Carcass life defined by the manufacturers are based on Air filled tires. Even though they warranty the carcass for 7 in most cases,the real safe life is closer to 5, or 6 years. So monthly cost difference between say 5 and 7 becomes quite significant.

I am sure a few here can talk about bubbles or separation, (but I don't want to fear monger here), leading to tire change in earlier than they would like! Others stretch that time closer to 6 or 7! One extra safe year on the scale.is nothing to sneeze at.

Understand that deterioration from the inside increases tire separation. Tire separation leads to blow outs, and blow outs lead to serious damage,or loss of life!!!

To close I will leave a reference:

Why Should I Fill My Tires With Nitrogen? | Drive Home Safe

Think I need a little time off!!!!

 

[Crazydog]

Thank you Mr. Penn. So what you said is there is no meaningful difference in the life of a tire filled with N as opposed to a tire filled with plain old 78% N from the air all around us.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

Thank you Mr. Penn. So what you said is there is no meaningful difference in the life of a tire filled with N as opposed to a tire filled with plain old 78% N from the air all around us.

Let me start with pem is My pen name,but your close!

And if 1 to 2 years on a thousand dollar investment is meaningless! Then maybe you are correct in your interpretation of my Post!!

Let me be more clear for you!!!

1000/60=14 or 168 per tire (rounded down) for each tire to stretch one more year out of it!
No tag 6 times 168 is 1008 for not using nitrogen 1344 with a tag.

I know most users of this site are savvy enough in economics to understand what I was saying!!! And by admission some people who have had blow outs, have stretched the Big Five! There is no guarantee a tire defect was not the reason, however nitrogen would have reduced the likelihood of tire separation!


One or two years is in fact meaningless to me as I have no reason to push replacement dates out, no tire is cheap, but I it was going to cost me 4grand to replace rubber on my truck then I might push the envelope from 5 to 6! But I like my old trailer,and truck to much to risk an early demise!!!

Hope that put more clarity to my post!!

Kevin D PEM

 

[redbaron]

As many of you know, I have a few really nice sports cars. I have had BMW's for 20+ years, and until this year the BMW dealer always used Nitrogen. When I purchased my latest M3 it came from the dealer with Nitrogen. Earlier this year I purchased a new Cadillac CT5V Blackwing, and it did not have nitrogen. I was a little disappointed, as I had always had nitrogen in my sports cars. I assumed that the crazy American's just where not as advanced as the Germans, so I took my Blackwing to the BMW dealer and asked for Nitrogen.

My rep was more than happy to fill it with nitrogen, and didn't even charge me, but while doing so he said that BMW USA has dropped the nitrogen requirement for all cars, including the M, as their data has shown no benefit from running nitrogen.

I personally see the benefit of not having to add or reduce air as the seasons change, but the automotive industry is moving away from it. I am not sure how Porsche is going to change, but my guess is they will continue to fill for a while as they began the trend for the sports cars.

I decided that it wasn't worth getting nitrogen tanks at the house, so I am now going back to 78% nitrogen for all my tires when they need it.

 

[Fueco]

As many of you know, I have a few really nice sports cars. I have had BMW's for 20+ years, and until this year the BMW dealer always used Nitrogen. When I purchased my latest M3 it came from the dealer with Nitrogen. Earlier this year I purchased a new Cadillac CT5V Blackwing, and it did not have nitrogen. I was a little disappointed, as I had always had nitrogen in my sports cars. I assumed that the crazy American's just where not as advanced as the Germans, so I took my Blackwing to the BMW dealer and asked for Nitrogen.

My rep was more than happy to fill it with nitrogen, and didn't even charge me, but while doing so he said that BMW USA has dropped the nitrogen requirement for all cars, including the M, as their data has shown no benefit from running nitrogen.

I personally see the benefit of not having to add or reduce air as the seasons change, but the automotive industry is moving away from it. I am not sure how Porsche is going to change, but my guess is they will continue to fill for a while as they began the trend for the sports cars.

I decided that it wasn't worth getting nitrogen tanks at the house, so I am now going back to 78% nitrogen for all my tires when they need it.

Exactly. I have a small compressor for filling tires. I mean, I got it for bicycle tires, but it works well on our cars. I check the tires regularly and fill them as needed (maybe three times per year.

 

[Crazydog]

I know it's difficult for some people to admit they've been paying for something that is absolutely worthless for years.
All I'm asking for is some actual data to support the claims of extended tire life using N. There seems to be only anecdotal evidence.
Otherwise I'll stick to 78%Nitrogen from my compressor.

My rep was more than happy to fill it with nitrogen, and didn't even charge me, but while doing so he said that BMW USA has dropped the nitrogen requirement for all cars, including the M, as their data has shown no benefit from running nitrogen.
Testing conducted independently by Consumer Reports and the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration shows that the benefits are more theoretical than practical.

 

[Alan_Hepburn]

My rep was more than happy to fill it with nitrogen, and didn't even charge me, but while doing so he said that BMW USA has dropped the nitrogen requirement for all cars, including the M, as their data has shown no benefit from running nitrogen.

Did he pull a vaccuum on the tire to remove all of the other gases before filling it with nitrogen?

 

[redbaron]

Did he pull a vaccuum on the tire to remove all of the other gases before filling it with nitrogen?

They pump them down to zero on the tires that I added air to.

Yet another reason I don’t want to try to do this at home, it’s not normal to have a pump to pull the air out and I don’t want to buy one.

 

[Kevin D Pem]

What the hell!

Quick calculation:

Volume= original volume (at 1 atmosphere,or your elevation)*(original volume/final pressure)

Zero volume would be impossible to obtain without a vacuum chamber due to the inability to hold a seal! However actual volume of O2 in both nitrogen vs air fill. At the pressure of inflation,using the formula above you can determine the actual volume of O2 in the tire.

No place that offers the service to my knowledge considers the volume at elevation pressure.

Furthermore, over time the O2 will escape the tire,just as the physics used to remove the O2 in their equipment does. You may ask if the tires will do the job anyhow, why bother? Well because the process of adding air will keep the O2 in abundant supply.

On the same principle, topping off the pressure with nitrogen, will continue to reduce any O2 that was in the volume of air during the original tire installation.

There comes a time that everything becomes foolishness, when carried beyond reason!!!

Have a good evening, and don't lose to much sleep over this!!!